The Rich Redmond Show

Unknown: Then I went through a
really difficult, just gut

wrenching period where I'm like,
Okay, I can't play football

anymore, like it's over, like no
one cares about how fast I can

run or how much I can lift. I'm
not a football player. For an

athlete, yeah, and I a lot of
times, for a musician, you find

your ego and what you do. And I
have had my whole life planned.

I made every decision around the
game. What does it look like? I

made all the sacrifices? I felt
like I worked really hard and I

deserved to be in a certain
spot. But when it didn't happen,

I kind of felt like, Okay, I've
done all that. How does that

apply to me now, you know. And
so I struggled. I struggle with

my confidence. I say this all
the time. I couldn't look at a

woman in the eyes because my
identity was so wrapped up in

how am I playing on the field?
How can I be anything for you if

I'm not pro?

This is the rich Redmond show.
What's the

Pro? Folks? Yep, your iPhone,
your clock, your watch, if you

still have a clock on your wall,
is correct? It's time. It's time

for another exciting episode of
the rich Redmond show, where we

talk about all things like
music, motivation, success. I've

talked to authors, comedians,
actors. No one cares. They want

to hear about drummers. Drummers
the spice of life, and I know a

lot of them. Jim McCarthy. Jim
McCarthy, voiceovers.com. Hi,

sir. How are you buddy? Good
man. We've been batching. We

haven't been batching. You know,
we've been out. We're not

bitching about it. Well, it's
this is a great time in human

history for us, because we
proved to ourselves that, like

everybody else in the world, we
could start a podcast during

COVID. It was like a little bit
before COVID, but then we kind

of doubled down during COVID,
and we got 200 episodes under

our belt. We did it. Man, high
five. Boom, ma'am, there we go.

You got any applause on that
thing? Uh, hold on. And we do

need us. We like Howard Stern in
the early days. We need a splash

symbol, and we need like a
rubber chicken. I think that

that'll always that'll always
work. Well, listen, we are.

We're sitting on a gold mine
because I know we're gonna have

an amazing conversation today.
Today's guest hailing from

Detroit, which is a monster
Music City, calling Nashville

home for 20 years, and recently,
a new Floridian calling Orlando

home for the last year, he's
been the drummer for the Grammy

Award winning band Little Big
Town for 10 years, celebrating

10 years with them, which is a
major accomplishment in this

massively competitive industry.
He's also worked with folks like

Pharrell Williams, David nail,
Jake Owen, Kemo, love and theft.

Leona Lewis, Adam Lambert, the
Oak Ridge Boys, list goes on and

on. Our friend. Hubert Payne,
what's up, man, what's up?

What's up. It is so good to have
you here. Now I gotta tell

everybody that you are such an
overachiever. We've been trying

to do this for a while, but I
was like, Are you sure you want

to drive to Spring Hill? Because
tonight you are playing a

headlining show in downtown
Nashville with your band, Little

Big Town at the Bridgestone
Arena. And we all know that

traffic is no joke in Nashville
now, like going back, like maybe

10 years, you know, but it's,
it's, it's fierce now. So thanks

for joining us. Thanks for
having me. I'm honored, man,

dude, we go way back. And I tell
you, look at this smile. I mean,

model actor, excited. Model
actor, like, for my heroes. When

did we meet? Though, it was with
Katie armagedd, yeah, yeah. And

was it was with Aldean in the
early days, I believe, and Katie

was opening, and you were her
drummer. And I was like, man,

that guy's got fire and Moxie
and attitude and physicality.

That's where we met.

When was that? The first thing I
thought about was having to

learn your parts? Oh, my God,
that's right, because we

produced her. And I'm a nerd, so
I remember I've had to figure

out how to, like, get my left
foot independence. Good, to do

splashes over at Rock groove. Oh
my gosh, don't do it. Oh, you're

so So you took that thing and
then added it to your package.

Oh,

yeah, that's what it's all
about. For me, yeah, I use it to

stop and hi hat over. I wonder
what's

going on with Katie. Yeah, I
don't know. She's awesome. And

had to, this must have been
like, 2006 Yeah, early, right,

right around there. So, but you
were also that was an early gig

for you. You were coming off a
football career, right? Tell us

about that. Because, I mean, you
look, you

look like an athlete, yeah,
yeah. So, from Detroit,

Michigan, and I was playing
football at school in Michigan,

Saginaw Valley, state. I went to
boarding school for high school

was all about sports. We didn't
have music, so I kind of was

only playing music alone

in my basement. I mean, did you
have the NFL in your site? So

that kind of like, Absolutely,

yeah. I thought I was gonna go
pro and play the game. So in

Michigan, the school I was at,
they moved me to defense. They

were like, we feel like you're a
physical player, and we want to

use you here. And I just, I
couldn't sleep. I couldn't I was

having a really difficult time,
and I had gained 20 pounds to

try to run the football, you
know. So, long story short, I

ended up transferring. And I
transferred to Middle Tennessee

State, and not knowing that I
was moving to music city. So was

that? So I played at Mt, 2002

three interesting, yeah, my
business partner went there and

you're about the same age, yeah,
yeah, I wonder if you knew each

other.

Yeah, I was a lot. All I did was
lift weights and play drums,

just

pounding chicken

breast. Yeah, I was pretty,
pretty, pretty locked in. But

yeah, and then I ended up
finishing my last few years at

Maryville College in East
Tennessee. Okay,

I gotta ask, being that you're
from Detroit. Yep, Lions fan.

Huge. It's the time right now,
right I'm a Lions fan right now.

Yeah. How can you not? What do
you mean just right now? Because

Courtney and I got into watching
these documentary shows, these

Docu series shows about
football, and they did one on

HBO. It's not on HBO, most think
about it in Amazon, but HBO is

doing one as well. Yeah, and
there's one that they did

profiling the lions. They embed
a film crew in the team, and

they put up like series episodes
out on like timely events. So

they embedded a team or a crew
with the lions right when Dan

Campbell came on board, and my
wife and I just fell in love

with the guy. Yeah, he's such a
great coach, yeah, and it's

like, because of him, we've
watched the games and become,

like, afar fans of the lions.
Now we're just cheering for him,

yeah, because I think they're 12
and one now, Yep, yeah, they're

super bowl bound,

buddy. Yeah, I can't say I was a
Dan Campbell believer in the

beginning, right? But what I do
love about it now is they are a

reflection of his spirit, right?
Like his principles they play.

And the funny thing is, by the
time this episode comes out, I

don't know when the Super Bowl
is going to be, probably

February, January, February, so
it's going to be, we're on the

precipice of the Super Bowl at
this point, usually

the second week of February,
right, right before Valentine's

Day. Yeah,

yeah. So,

I mean, it's hopefully
everything we're talking about

here, kind of projects forward,
and we're speaking goodness into

the Yeah, I'd love to see them
as a Detroit Yeah,

well, as a top down thing. You
know, a team's culture, I'm sure

starts with the coach has

to Yeah, well, starts from the
owner and then the general

manager. I would think
everything starts from

the top. So, so you had your
sights set. Yeah, you were doing

the thing.

So I thought then I went through
a really difficult, just gut

wrenching period where I'm like,
Okay, I can't play football

anymore, like it's over, like no
one cares about how fast I can

run or how much I can lift. I'm
not a football player,

right? What this is strange.
This is explain. Explain. So,

you know, for a foot, for an
athlete, yeah, and I a lot of

times for a musician, you find
your ego and what you do. And I

have had my whole life planned.
I made every decision around the

game. What does it look like? I
made all the sacrifices? I felt

like I worked really hard and I
deserved to be in a certain

spot, but when it didn't happen,
I kind of felt like, Okay, I've

done all that. How does that
apply to me now? You know? And

so I struggle. I struggle with
my confidence. I say this all

the time. I couldn't look at a
woman in the eyes because my

identity was so wrapped up in
how am I playing on the field?

How can I be anything for you if
I'm not pro? Right? Interesting,

yeah. But the awesome part of
that was, when it came to music,

there's no ego. I'm a football
player, yeah? So, yeah, I can go

to your house and just watch
what you eat for breakfast,

because I want to learn what
you're doing. Yeah, there's no

ego. I'm a football player.
Yeah, I can ask rich 1000

questions, yeah?

Because so there was total
humility around your upcoming

music career,

which is awesome, yeah? Yeah,
that was the blessing, and I

didn't really understand that at
the time, yeah? But when I look

back, I'm like, wow, the
humility at every step in my

career was really the thing that
separated me. Because a lot of

people that play drums and at a
point, everyone can play a song,

yeah, but do you want to be
around that person and their

energy 24 hours a day? Can they

play it well, that's right,
yeah, that's right. That's

right. So that you know the
football thing, and I'm we'll

get to it in the story, but it's
all, it's really coming full

circle at this season of my
life.

So were you always, even though
you had the aspiration and the

laser focus to be a professional
football player, were you also

playing drums? Cinder pops was a
drummer. My dad

was a drummer. He took care of
us, playing the drums. He's a

phenomenal drummer. Amazing.
Still playing No no he he messes

around. Now he's starting to
come back. I got him a drum set

for Christopher go for his
birthday. So he's he's coming

back. But for him. He just felt
like, you know, my son, he hates

when I share this with the
truth. He dropped out of high

school to play drums. He went
back and finished. But he's he

built his life around the drum
set, right? And he took care of

me and my brothers playing the
drums. Even though he was a

great drummer and one of the top
call guys, he wanted more for

me. He didn't want me to live
gig, to gig. Yeah, because you

can go on a great tour for three
or four or five years, and then

it's over, and you're, you know,
you got to figure it out. Yeah,

tough to sustain a marriage and
a family. And if you want, like,

I wanted babies. I want, I
wanted a bunch of kids ever

since I was a kid, yeah, and he
knew, and so he felt like, I

know you're gonna play drums,
but I'm not gonna put you in

position to focus on that right
now. So I just kind of, I

watched him. I never had any
friends that played drums when I

was growing up. I play African
drums in a group. But as far as

drum set, I just played by
myself, doing like Jim Bay.

Yeah, I played Jim Bay, so, but
when it came to drum set, it was

really just in my own head,
yeah, which later on, I realized

that's also a blessing, because
I my pocket comes from listening

to myself for 20 years before I
played with people. Yeah, you

know what I mean. So,

yeah, your dad was in a in a
recording act called the

dramatics. Yes. And also work
with Snoop Dogg

Andrew, yes, yeah, yes, he did.
He lived in LA and worked with

Dr Dre in the studio, just
putting down beats, sneaking

background vocals, whatever it
called for that day. Nice. That

was a great experience. Now

he your dad's going to go see
you play tonight. Yes, this has

got to he's got to be very
proud. He's very

proud now, yeah, he's also very
proud that I have other options.

Yeah, now,

people love to hear about
paradiddles and stuff. We don't

talk a lot about that. What are
the other options? Because you

and I resonate in that sense, in
that sense that we know how

drums fit into the big picture
in life, and how we can make

other people happy and change
lives doing it. But also in that

process, there's a way for us to
have an our name on the marquee.

It's it's amazing to be part of
huge organizations. You know

these, you know these groups
going down the high with it,

with their tractor trailers and
busses, and they pull up and,

ladies and gentlemen, and you're
part of that thing, and it feels

amazing, but have your name on
the marquee, and you figured

that out. You're doing that. I'm

doing that, yeah, and I have to
just put a pin right here and

share something with you. You
probably remember it, but you

made me dangerous. And part
reason why I'm like, Yeah, my

whole family's come to the show
tonight, and you know, we're

gonna play a headlining show at
Bridgestone. But I'm like, this

is an opportunity to spread how
you personally helped me become

dangerous. I don't know anything
about this is good. This is

good. Jim, this is exciting. So
when I first got little, big

town, you know, lot of people
were shooting me texts. Hubert,

Congrats, man, you called me and
I'm like, Rachel called me like,

you're like, man, congrats. This
is an awesome opportunity where

you're going to be. I'm going to
be honest with you, it's not the

ceiling is not much higher,
right? And knowing that, just

keep it 100 and real
financially, you're going to be

close to the ceiling, yeah? And
if you don't make a decision to

diversify and figure out other
things that you can do to take

care of your your family or your
life. You'll be stuck now it was

a tragic, tragic thing to only
point at the artist to take care

of you and your life at that
point, because you can literally

use your position to to multiply
what you can make. I came out of

the blue and said that, yes, you
went in on me. You're like, man,

you even went through your own
habits. Think about this, the

perception of the opportunity
you have. You can build an

opportunity off that. Yeah, you
can develop your skill set. You

can keep reinventing yourself.
And that message, along with

little, big talent, just being,
I mean the sweetest people

you've ever met, and

they've had you on all their
records. They've had me

on the records, yeah. And to
take it a step further, they saw

that, you know, number one, I
have six kids, and they know,

they know how much I make, yeah.
And I don't know if it's just

because of the money, but
they've been very proactive

about Hubert, if you want to do
this, we're going to help you do

this has nothing to do with
music. If I can introduce you to

someone, I will if we can put
you in position, if we can

represent you, if we can put in
a word, if we can, you know, put

you in this room. Hey, you
should be thinking about this.

There's been times Karen, over
to Mike, has said. It Hubert

paint on the drums. He's an
awesome life coach, according to

who she knows, right? It's
awesome.

I mean, there's people, you
know, I've been around them

backstage, you know, the skirm
horn and just various things and

and they probably want to help
you be because you never mail it

in for them. No. I mean, you
could be sick and jet lagged,

and it's like, you know what
your job is, and you know what

you have to do, and you do it
with a spot that smile. That's

right. So maybe

they need a podcast, and I could
produce the podcast, what

do you need a podcast? Call Jim
to have them and ask them

questions that will benefit
people would be amazing. Yeah,

I've learned so much from them.
They are but

was one of the requirements to
be born and raised and

that's the same good episode
from laugh USA, totally.

But I mean that How exciting. I
mean it's like, congratulations

on, you know, 10 years. What is
that? You know, 3650 days of

playing those songs, traveling
the world that, like, off the

top of your head, yeah? I just
had a couple zeros, and just

never mailing it in, you know,
and just bringing your spirit

and your energy to the drums.
And that's really what the drums

are. It's like, it's, it's a
extension of our own spirit and

energy, yeah. And I really feel
like most drummers are, are more

often than not, friendly,
approachable, high energy,

outgoing. People rarely do. I
meet a drummer that's like,

yeah. Like Steven Wright, yeah,
goes to be here. You know what I

mean? There are some

drummers I've seen that are just
like they couldn't get hitting

the space bar on their laptop.
You know, they just, it was odd.

I went to a show. I'm not going
to name names or bands or

anything, but we went to a show
and it's of a band that I want

to play in, and he just like,
you know, the singer had to go

back and help him during the
show.

Oh, I mean, if all he's got to
do is press space bar, we can

handle that. Like, the drummer
was like, whatever,

you know, you do your thing, and
I'm gonna sit here and wait,

yeah, yeah, interesting. Well,
that's not that guy. No, no, no,

no. Drummers, I find are
octopuses. They're, we're able

to get into a lot of other
things besides the drums, and

maybe it's because we're so
multifaceted with the instrument

and, you know, multitasking. I
mean, I'm a drummer, and look

what's, you know, everything
that's in front of me here, I

feel like I'm sitting at, you
know, the Starship Enterprise

driving thing. Yeah, you're

totally as a great point. Yeah,
my one of my good buddies, my

favorite musician in the world,
Akil Thompson, plays with with a

big time, yeah, he and I talk
about this all that's Chester

son.

Chester Thompson. He plays keys.
He plays keys. And just

keep him away from the drones,
because he can play very well. I

remember seeing him a lot at the
blue bar in Midtown Nashville,

going back like 15 years. Yeah,

yeah. He and I, we get into all
kinds of life and really deep

conversations about
musicianship. And we we talk

about the stories that musicians
make up about well, this is all

I can do. This is what I do. But
we are so multifaceted. To your

point, if you open that door, I
had this past, maybe since I've

been in Orlando, had a job as
Director of Sports Performance.

I can't believe I'm saying that.
This is great. Say it again. Say

it again. I was Director of
Sports Performance, over 110,000

square foot facility in Lake
Nona in Orlando, huge facility.

I got the job, and it was my
first time really. I've had a

couple other things that I've
been doing since I've been a

little big time, but this
particular job is, like, very

corporate. I'm talking about,
you're going to meetings two and

three times a week, and and
looking at quarter one and

revenue and and making certain
changes, and being in those

rooms, I'm like, Oh my gosh.
Musicians are so creative. We're

so resourceful, and we don't
realize that our skill set can

be transferred in those rooms
and just light fires every day

and but we, we take this mindset
of like, Man, I gotta sell out

to the game. I call it like the
tattoo on face mentality. It's

like, well, if I'm a musician,
I'm really doing this. I can't

be doing anything else. It's
lies.

Man, yeah, it's a mindset. It's
a limited mindset. You heard

that too, you know, what else am
I? I mean, the previous

episodes. Guy, what else am I
gonna do? Dude, you're a pilot.

You've got so many other skill
sets,

so and, and there's just so much
beauty in. Then someone who sat

down for their whole life used
their imagination to create

music, we take it for granted.
It is a beautiful gift. I

do feel like we get, we get beat
down mentally by the

expectations and limitations of
our industry. Because if you're

you know not, if you're not
writing the songs, you're not

the front person. Sometimes
there's a massive chasm between

and and so people just accept
their the lot. They're a lot in

life. But there's, God, you roll
up your sleeves and you just do

some thinking, and if you're not
not afraid to shout from a

mountaintop, I exist. And that's
something that, you know, I have

gotten in trouble for, you know,
hey, you know, I've made some

mistakes with social media over
promoting, but at the same time,

I'm also not afraid to let
people know, hey, somebody's

gonna get the job. Why not me,
right? Mm, hmm, you just throw

your hat. Why not me throw your
hat in the ring? You know, went

to Los Angeles for five years at
great expense, on Mondays,

Tuesdays and Wednesdays for five
years. I studied TV hosting,

voiceover, improv comedy acting,
and I got my sag card in under

five years. And there's people
that have been acting for 25

years that still don't have that
freaking card, and I did it in

under five years, in only three
days a week. So it's what we do

with our mind. Starts in the
mind, right? And then the path

will be revealed. You just have
to have that desire to do

something, and you're doing it,

yeah. So one thing that I
learned I want to share about

this experience, so I worked at
it's a wellness retreat

facility. It's called on site
workshops. It's about hour and a

half outside of Nashville, and
people go there and do deep

healing work. It is phenomenal,
man, I was talking about people

who are dealing with loss,
death, people who face public

shame, people were just
overworked. So it's not

necessarily a 30 day intensive
rehab. It's not, it's not for

addiction, right? It's just, I
need to go get centered. And I

worked there. I was hired as the
only coach ever a Karen

Fairchild connect, by the way,
but I was hired as the only

coach, and they brought me in,
and they taught me the method of

how to like walk people from A
to B. And it's fascinating work.

But one thing that I took from
that was the trauma piece, and I

realized without trauma, right?
And I define trauma as anytime

we can't respond from power. So
if you got a situation in your

life, you can't respond from
power, you form a defensive

posture internally, with your
emotions, with what you hope

for, and what I hear you saying
is, man, sometimes, why not me?

And we get stuck because we have
all these defensive postures of,

oh, they told me I couldn't that
oh, maybe the way I had to be

with my parents is not really
conducive to like that voice

that's inside of me, right? So
at on site I was I had the

opportunity to see people walk
through those walls, and I

started realizing, like, oh my
gosh, everything is about

connecting to that authentic
version. And the trauma creates

an environment where, if you
gonna heal from it, that's gonna

be the gift, if you think about
it, if you lose someone, you

don't have time or energy to
think about anything else other

than what's gonna get you to
healing in the other side, yeah?

Like you just you shut down a
noise, right? But it's just, we

all have different things that
happen, different levels of

that, but that journey of being
able to connect to this is

authentically me. I'm good
enough. What's for me is for me.

What's not is not. We can't be
competing, because we all have a

different fingerprint, yeah? And
when I learned that, and then

brought that back to the music,
I'm like, Oh my gosh, this is

what I want to do. And this is,
this is why the drum journey was

the drum journey, yeah, my dad,
the way he poured into me, my

parents, my mom, she's amazing.
This is why, right, like, so I

can go off on a tangent.

So the on site thing is, yeah,
is that a franchise or it's just

here in Middle Tennessee? So

they have one here. They have a
location in California as well.

Um, the one here is the flagship
program. Is the Living Center

Program, yeah, and music cares,
does an amazing job of

connecting musicians so it is
not cheap. I'll say that

I was gonna say a retreat where
you go to recenter. Yes, this is

upper income. Yes, that can
afford this. Yes.

Uh, five days, all inclusive,
they take your phone, but, uh,

Mills, but the awesome
opportunity musicians have is

music cares. They see us, and
they have opportunities through

music cares where, if you're in
a way, or your spouse is in a

way, or a loved one, they can
help you build a bridge to go

there and experience that work,
yeah, and my hope is, because

what I've done in the last few
years started to realize, like,

Okay, I see a journey that helps
people deal with their mental

health. But then I started
realizing, like, wait a minute,

that's the same journey for high
performance. There is no

disconnect. And once you
realize, oh man, the same things

that are stopping me from
showing up and being able to

connect to my relationship are
the same things that are

stopping me from connecting with
the instrument I'm being robbed

of being present because of what
happened to me. Right? Yeah. So

I've been on this journey of
like, oh my gosh, these there's

the blueprint is very similar.
How can I spread that to as many

people as possible? Yeah, and
learn along the way. So that's

what fires me up. So from

studying all this, yeah,
psychology, mental health, high

performance tactics, when you
sit behind the drums these days,

are you treating your
performance differently, or the

things that are happening in
your mind differently? Yes,

different,

yes, yeah, I would say number
one thing. So if you, if you, if

you look at trauma, that
defensive posture I got to

protect myself from things that
look like past, things that hurt

me, yeah, the first way we all
have, we all have that in

different

ways. It could be very subtle,
just the way, the way our

parents talk to us or treated
us. Yes, I

also believe we have like
versions of performance trauma.

I didn't get that audition. So
I'm gonna protect myself from

putting myself in those
situations by being defensive,

and I'm gonna fly a little bit
lower, like a diet version of

myself, so I don't hurt again.
Wow, right? So we get robbed of

the present moment, if I can, if
I'm thinking about like I've

been, I've been working on this
concept. It comes from a

therapeutic concept, but it
basically says, Okay, we

organize that internal voice in
three ways, either the parent,

the adult or the child, right?
It's called transactional

analysis. If you think about it
like this, and the parent voice

is super concerned with the
future. Don't do that if you

think about any, any kind of
mental self talk that's got that

wagon finger, and a lot of times
it comes from whoever our

caretaker was or wasn't, yeah,
right, don't do this. Don't do

that, yeah,

my dad was scary, right? Yeah,
anxious. That's

right. About the future, that's
right, that's right, the child,

the child version, consumed with
the past, right? And you know,

you can bounce between these
voices. They might be applicable

in certain moments, but you want
to be consumed with the adult,

because the adult is present.
The adult pauses before here,

her speaks and can make
decisions based on the present

moment. So if I'm playing music
grooving, which is my favorite

thing, is about being present.
And I learned that from

Broadway, because you never know
who you're gonna play with. And

everybody's like, Oh man, I
don't want to go down there and

you're gonna be playing with all
these guys. I'm like, man, what

an opportunity to figure out how
to

like stretches you play with
stretches.

Okay, what does the band need to
groove right now? And I'm going

to become that.

So you did your time down there?
Oh yeah. When was that? Oh

man, after Katie armagedd, yeah,
I probably, I've played on

Broadway most of my time. A
little big time, yeah.

Oh yeah. So that never bothered
you to say, Okay, I got a drum

tech. I'm with this huge act. We
got busses and catered meals,

and now I'm going to slip my
drums down into Legends and and

play for tips

Absolutely. That didn't bother
you, no, because it's about,

it's about skill acquisition,
all right, right,

Jim, this is, it's good stuff.
This is good stuff because

a lot of folks are like on do
that.

So for me, it goes back to the
football thing. In my culture of

sports, you don't make it to the
NFL and stop lifting weights,

right? It's triple down at that
triple down, right? Drums. I

love playing the drums. I love
it. So I want to be the best

player I can be. The gigs will
be a symptom. If Little Big Town

ended tomorrow, you know, you're
still gonna play the drums. I'm

gonna play the drums. I love
helping people's song come to

life and using the instrument
Amen And and so for me, I'm

like, Okay. If people practice
eight hours a day, why do I feel

like I'm excluded? Like, if
that's what it takes, that's

what it takes, that's an
opportunity to play for four

hours with people and make some
money. So you're

getting the little, big town gig
was, you're almost like a hyper

validation from the universe,
like, Hey, I'm good. This

happened. I achieved this thing,
and now I'm gonna keep working

on this skill set.

Oh yeah, yeah, oh yeah. I mean,
and even, even getting the gig,

was, it was insane. It was
insane. So was

there people are always asking,
you know, hey, is the audition

thing a thing anymore? And I'm
like, doesn't seem like it, it

seems like it's all
relationships, yes, guys calling

their buddies, yes, right? But
that was a big audition, right?

It was like, it was like a
cattle call.

I don't know if it was a cattle
maybe a cattle call before they

start bringing people in, but
uh, Seth, put my name in a hat,

gotcha. And I was playing with
David nails. So they, they it's,

I want to tell the story,
because I love Seth, and I know

Seth has been on the show, Heck,
yeah. And I really want to,

I love that dude, Seth Roush,
What's up, buddy? We go way back

to and, you know, I remember
first meeting him, and he was

just playing with everybody, and
he had his rock tea and his

blazer on. I was like, Yo male
model. I mean, you know, the

kitty and just like, crushing
it, I'm like,

he looked like when he walked
in. Chris Cornell. Chris

Cornell, totally looks like.
Chris. Getting back to what

you're saying about the voice in
your head you follow a lot of, I

would imagine the same people
that I follow, Gary V and

CARDONE and stuff like that.
Bradley. Bradley,

yeah. So

I got some opinions about all
those guys. Yeah, yeah. I'm sure

you do awkward silence. So Brad

Lee has said something in the
past that's always resonated

with me. He's, I'm actually
going to his house on Sunday,

yeah, reconfigure his studio for
him. He called me today, but he

he said, what pronoun is the
voice in your head using? And I

was like, Is it a you, or is it
a me? Type of, you know, I'm

gonna do the lose 50 pounds by,
you know, my birthday? No,

you're not. Or no, I'm not that
way. I was like, Oh, that's

good. You ever pay attention to
the pro town? What pronouns they

use? Yeah, yeah, that crazy,
yeah, because I mean, it's true,

yeah, it's external, or it's
you,

absolutely. And a lot of times
that gets convoluted.

So, so what are your opinions on
those guys? Well,

I'll more talk about what I feel
like. Don't forget your story

about Seth, yeah, sorry, it'll
transition. I'm a big love. I'm

a faith based Christian, dude,
yeah. And one thing that I

learned at on site that just it
was huge. I dove into a

therapeutic model called
internal family systems. And the

idea is that our internal
environment is different parts,

different voices, and even when
it comes to addiction, we don't

have any bad parts. And if you
have parts of a family that are

out of control or overreacting,
you don't stand up to them. You

don't. People don't they're not
lacking willpower. You know it's

not about I'm not strong enough
to say, no, what have you loved

yourself in the right position,
right? It's not about cursing

yourself down off the ledge. I
feel like there's an alternate

way to healing and operating
from health, and I think, is

based in extreme compassion,
extreme curiosity and and things

like that, as opposed to the
finger. And, you know, I can't

believe you did that again. You
know, if you think about it,

didn't work well in music,
either. Yeah, and, and you'll

groove better when it's when
it's your breathing, which I

learned from Seth. But Seth and
I preached this man, take

responsibility for your
inspiration. Anything inspires

you, I don't care if it's the
most small thing you're curious

about. Keep going down that road
and you get to that, that part

where you talking about earlier,
like, this is me. It's my

authentic version. So I was
playing with David Neil, and I

loved Little Big time. And I
love more specifically, Seth, to

the point where I would listen
to all his records and like, I'm

like, Man, Seth does that a lot.
Pontoon. Boom, he does that.

Even when I say it, I can feel
like his body motion and so,

like, I'm like, my buddy, Blaine
knew him, and I said, Blaine,

we're playing with little, big
town this festival, like, later

this month, you got to connect
me with Seth. He texted him.

Seth was like, yeah, we'll
connect. So I meet Seth in a

trailer. Um. For this, this con.
It was like, you know, with the

wood pan? I'm like, Yeah,
knocking the door. He's in

there, hanging out. I'm like,
the door opens up. He's got a

light over his head. I'm like,
No. Like, Seth, Rush. So I sit

down, and I proceed to ask this
man probably 1000 questions in

an hour. Like, dude, what were
you thinking on tornado? Why

didn't you play the hi hat? What
on pontoon? Like, where'd that

groove come from? And then it
got I'm like, don't think I'm

weird. I know you got five kids.
How do you do it? Like, I heard

that, you know? Like, it's like
a legend around little big time.

He used the runner every day to
go to mass or church, and his

faith was very important to him,
so I was just asking him, how do

you integrate in all these
things?

Wow, he's taking the runner to
go to church every show day. I

don't know if I was supposed to
share

that. Wow. He's very
disciplined. And, like, I just

look up to him so much, wow.

Um, and he had five kids, and
you're like, I'm doing six.

Well, he's got

six now he had another one.

Yeah, so, so, so he's kind of
looking at me, like, man, you

really listened. I'm like, Yeah,
bro. Like, I love what you do.

Your groove is, like, it
inspired me, yeah? So he, he

came out. I saw him watch me. He
play, watch two songs, and I'm

like, All right. I saw him walk
off the stage. I didn't think

anything of it. And a few months
later,

well, I'll say this, I asked
him. I said, Seth, your

little big time. You're playing
on the records. What's next for

you? He's like, dude, nothing's
next. I love this band. I get to

play on the records. We work,
just enough great. He didn't

know about Keith Urban. He's
gonna call him. So when he got

the call, he put my name in the
hat for the audition. Well,

it's perfect, because it's
awesome. He loved your vibe and

energy. And he also knew you
knew the material. Yeah, you're

like, plug

and play. That's right. So I
kind of cheated in the audition.

Of like, I've been thinking
about this moment. I've been

watching little, big town and
thinking, if I got that gig,

this is what I would do with it,
right? And I think Karen

appreciates that, and she felt
my conviction right, because you

got all you know, in Audition,
it's all kinds of nerves flying.

But I was convicted about, this
is what I got to say about if I

had this opportunity, right?
Yeah, and I got all these kids,

so I need some help. Yeah,

somebody tells me you're a great
dad. I mean, I try, I mean, but

that seems like a, I mean, I'm
just like, one child would be

such a just a challenge. So,

yeah, I think the secret to
being a great dad is thinking

that you're an awful dad, yeah,
that's, that's where, that's

what I think about me. That's
where I

am, Jim, you are not an awful
dad. Well, that's the but

that's,

you know, it kind of keeps you
grounded. Yeah? You know that I

could be always doing better,
yeah? And, you know, your kids

will remind you if you screw

up Absolutely. Seems incredibly
difficult to find the balance

between being friendly and
nurturing and loving and at the

same time being a task master
and letting them know that they

messed up and punishing them.
And that's a lot,

especially when you're working
in a mental health space and you

sit with people and you realize
your parents screwed you up. And

my parents, no one's parents are
perfect, and most of the time,

you can trace certain behavior
patterns back to parents. And

for me, my wife is phenomenal.
She's like the one person that

could navigate what we've tried
to build, what we've been

building, and so, and someone
said this to me one time, like,

you know, what you're trying to
do is impossible. I'm like,

Yeah, that's right, it's
impossible. That gives me some

grace, yeah, but

I mean to be an amazing father,
yeah? And then build your

speaking and play the drums and
all the travel associated with

it. Last time I checked, it's
only 24 hours in the day, yeah,

but they drive me, yeah. Like, I
don't. I love playing the drums,

but like, my decisions are made
around providing, and that's why

it's important for me, and my
hope is that I get more

opportunities with, like, I
appreciate this, to speak to

musicians. And it's like, we
come up with these dreams when

we're young. We don't really
calculate. All right, so when I

get married, if I want to get
married, and then when I have

kids, like, how am I going to do
that, you know, and still play?

And I think, man, the heart
position and the reasons why you

do it? They have to. They have
to line up, right? And if they

don't, you know, figure out your
priorities and then work from

there. Yeah, and I want to be
the one that helps people do

that. Like there are a lot of
dads and moms that are trying to

figure out I have. This love for
this music, and this is what

it's going to take for me to go
out and do it. And I have this

love for these children and my
spouse. How do they both

coexist? And I don't know that
there's enough resources out

there, or people talking about
that, like, I love parados. I'm

a nerd. I love all that. I love
it, but I appreciate the

opportunity there

might be, there might be a like
a book or a coaching program for

musicians. I mean, I see that
now, now I know that you have

been starting to speak, and are
you, what kind of venues are

hiring you, and what is the
angle of your talk?

So, beautiful thing about being
at on site, I can pretty much go

in any direction, right? I've
been dealing with a lot more

football players, so I'd go a
lot of college football teams

and speak. They're

probably and people love music.
They're enamored. It's like a

mystical it's like a it's like,
I don't want to call it like a

dark art but it's like, it's
such a mystery. Musical

artists want to be athletes, and
athletes absolutely always.

Every

time there's athletes backstage,
they're just like, oh my god,

you guys are living the dream,
and you're filthy rich, like

you're rich.

Yeah, it's very interesting. My
one of my main messages is about

transition and figuring out
transferable skills. Yeah,

right. That's huge for me,
because when I went through the

phase, I talked about where,
okay, not a football player.

That hurt. But it's also a
blessing in that, because it's

like, Wait, I don't need that
ball to define my ego anymore.

What I learned was how to learn
from people, yeah, how to be

very detailed about watching
someone else perform, and then

being able to put all those
traits and characteristics in my

own bag. That's what I learned.
I learned about what is the

actual culture of getting
better.

You also, I guess, of a side,
seeing you from the outside, you

put a lot of emphasis on the
identity being in football, but

you also had the identity as
being a drummer. Maybe the

emphasis the hierarchy, is more
priority to football. In your

mind, it was, yeah, it was,
here's the thing, and I always

talk about this with athletes,
is that even my wife grew up

very athletic, her brothers did
as well. I said, here's the

thing about the difference
between that kids like me who

took the musical path versus the
athletic path, is that at some

time, at some point, the
athletic path, you just can't do

it anymore. That's right, your
body can win poses, yeah. The

musician path, you can do it
into your 60s. And

the speaker path, you could do
it till you drop dead with that

mic in your hand. Boom.

That's why I love it. That's why
I love it. And one thing about

music, and I was trying to
explain this to my daughter,

probably being a little bit too
hardcore. She's only 11, and

playing flute. Her concerts are
this week, and I hate that I

missed him but, but she's like,
Dad, it's just this one piece.

I'm really struggling with it.
I'm like, well, babe, when's

your concert Friday? I'm like,
What's today is Monday? Game

practice? I'm like, here's the
thing about music, it's a lot

different from sports and
football. You can train all day

and eat, eat eat well, and, you
know, make sacrifices and play

running back and someone not
blocking, you can't run through

the hole, right? Music, you know
the song is going to be 334, you

know when it's going to happen.
You You have heard either the

drummer who recorded it. You've
heard you know you you can

create a plan about how you want
to execute it, and it's just

about, are you going to be
willing to sit there and be

patient enough to to master that
performance and then do it in

front of people or with people?
Yes, you know what the song is

going to be. Yeah, there is no
guessing game. Yeah.

I mean, in football, anything
can happen, right? You're

guessing what the play is gonna
be, and then as that play is

happening, you got a jib and jab
in the moment. It's like jazz.

It is true improvisation. I wish
I had played sports a little bit

more, like I experimented with
some things. I mean, I was a

pretty dang good disco roller
skater. I was a speed skater,

which is a very bougie New
England thing to do. And I tried

T ball, but I just knew I had
those sticks. Yeah, man, you

know, they kicked the soccer
ball to me. I ran the wrong way.

I mean, I just it wasn't my
thing. I was but, and I will

say, if you guys are, if you
guys feel like this podcast, is

that the I'd hit that podcast,
it's a very famous podcast, but

it's really noisy. Yeah, he's
always set up at some restaurant

or something, Jim's, this is his
place of business, and he's

having his Christmas party out
there. Yeah, so people are

starting to eat through sugar
cookie. Season they're getting

home, she worked up on sugar,

yeah, certainly not alcohol,
that's for sure. No way, no,

no way. So this, I mean, this
is, this is fascinating. And as

you know, it's my thing, my
challenge, even all these years

in, you know, as a speaker, you
know that entire industry seems

to run most effectively being
you're represented by a bureau,

so you're with Washington
speakers bureau, or you're with

all these different little
boutique bureaus, and somebody

you know from corporate America,
you know, they call up the

agency, and they're like, you
know, we need somebody in the

entertainment space, or we need
someone in the education space.

And we'd like it to be below
this dollar amount. And if you

go above this dollar amount, you
know, you can get our ex

saxophone playing president. But
if you go down this direction,

you can get a drummer, you know,
so, but the thing is, is that

the whole industry is based on
that, and it's they don't

necessarily market on your
behalf and go to the you know,

get down and dirty for you. They
just respond to the interest

from the caller. So how do we
figure out how to get more work?

And for me, it's just been
through human relationships. You

know? Is that how you find you
get your gigs? Yeah,

so man, like I got, I've spoke.
I did universal, Universal

Studios in Orlando, big I spoke,
and it went really well, and I

traded tickets, lot of tickets,
but they called me back this

this past week and said, Hey,
can you come back and speak

again so you repeat business?
Yeah, I'm like, this is, this is

awesome. It's great. And I can,
I could definitely be a lot more

strategic in the speaking lane,
but I think I was just speaking

on mental health, yeah, and and
performance, because to me, it's

the same thing. I don't, I
don't, there are, there's two

schools of thinking. There's a
lot of people who feel like, if

you take an athlete or a
musician, you get them out of

that environment, you rescue
them, and then you put them in a

space to just really work on
their mental health. But you and

I know, if the gig doesn't go
well, we sit with that, yeah

and, and the way to get me from
A to B and operating from the

healthy versions of myself, we
got to address how I'm playing,

how I'm not playing, yeah, like,
what are the gaps? Like, let's

deal with that. So to me, I mix
high performance and mental

health. So whatever it is that
you do, it's two things. Same

thing to me, high performance in
relationships, because what I

found is people get broken in
three ways, in relationship with

relationship with other people,
with themselves or their higher

power and and you can put it in
that box of once we get broken,

we get defensive. So if I can
help people build that bridge

back to being connected with
that hopeful version of me,

yeah, or what I hoped about you
in our relationship or my higher

power, whatever it is, right?
Um, that's good work. So I just

try to operate from that lens.
And somebody can tell me

anything. Hey, Hubert we want
our employees to be better at

having difficult conversations?
I'm like, Okay, I'm gonna bring

it back to that. Okay, what's
your self talk? Are you able to

have difficult conversations
with yourself. You know what I

mean? Start there, no. So

a lot of times, you know, I'll
have a difficult conversation

with myself in the mirror, and
then

I go, All right, let's go for
glass one. Yeah,

I'll just bury my bury my
feelings. Which is not the whole

thing about mental health, as we
know that it's, it's a daily

thing. Yeah, it's like, what are
the things that are going to

center you? I mean, I like to
get up in the morning. I have a

little quiet time myself, a nice
dark cup of coffee. I gots to

stretch. I gotta hydrate, I
gotta go on a walk. I gotta read

something, gotta do something
for my that's got to be

difficult to because you know
how they say put yourself first

so you can show up for everyone
else. How do you put yourself

first when you got six kids?
Man, that's

tough. Grace. Yeah, so you said
something. You said, I'll have

this hard talk with myself, and
then I'll just go to the wine.

Dang. That's public record,
guys, I think I I think

here's, here's here's what's
important, though, there's a lot

of people that are in that
cycle, and it might not be wine,

it might be something else.
Sure, I feel like we all

perfectly got right where we are
right, and understanding that,

and throwing in a ton of grace,
you know, we're just all trying

to figure out how to make it
work. And if you approach

yourself with grace, like, as
far as far as what I know that's

the best way to do it. In other
words,

don't be so hard on your That's
right, that's right. Like, push

yourself. But if something
happens where you don't get your

workout in, or you don't get
your me time, or something

doesn't go as planned, don't be
so hard, I know.

So you love it into right size,
and I bet you it would go a

whole lot better. And, you know,
especially high performers, like

I would imagine, the internal,
rich voice on the drums is like,

Hey, man, you gotta, you gotta
be more clean. You gotta really

give this part the energy it
needs. Yeah. But a lot of times

that voice spills out into our
relationships. And I'ma speak

from personal experience. The
guy, the voice here, my dad's a

very hands on. He was
disciplinary and very like

present with me, mine too. And
his voice is that critical.

Voice is there, and is great for
developing on the drums or, you

know, skill set, it is not so
great developing in relationship

with the woman or even my kids,
right? Was he encouraging,

though? To you? Oh, yeah. Super
encouraging. Very positive,

dude. Yeah. I

had my brother on my podcast not
too long ago, and you remember

my brother said, what lives in
his head is our father telling

him, if you go to music, you're
going to be a garbage man.

That's tough. And that, I mean,
but that that your brother took

that to heart, yeah,

but he, he ended up doing the
path that was laid before him

instead of what he felt like he
could do. Yeah, you know, he

became the attorney. He went to
college, and he does that. He's

okay being he's happy being an
attorney. He's a great attorney,

but he's at the stage of life
where he could move here and

have leverage and give it a
shot. And I've been encouraging

him to do that, yeah, hopefully
he does. So, yeah.

So on that point, it's never too
late to step into your

authenticity, because it's
always there. It's always there.

I mean, I like, I have my own
band now, the networks, funk

band. Yeah, tell

me. So what was the inspiration
to be like you just wanted to

have a creative outlet for
yourself, where you can call the

shots, pick the repertoire, hire
the players, you get it, yeah?

Because

at a point you realize being an
amazing side man is being an

amazing waiter. Yeah, I'm here
to serve. We serve you. Don't

want me to play the symbol. I
will not. And I'm a smile, not

playing the symbol. That's
right, and that's the gig.

That's right. It's not my gig.
It's not my business. And that

reflects, you know, and and the
you know, it's not my band. I'm

happy to be here. I will
contribute as much as you'd

like, my ideas or not, yeah. But
with my band, I just, I got some

guys together that I felt like I
wanted to play with. Like, who

could I just play with? Two
o'clock in the afternoon? Who

would I want to play with? Nice

and that's a great way to, yeah,
to find the guys, yeah. Who

would I want to play with, just
right now, right now

and and what's interesting that
I found, we just started getting

in a room and playing, and I
found, I feel like I found my

voice, like I kind of knew who I
was on the drums and what I'm

not, you know, working towards,
yeah, but creating helps you get

the fingerprint, you know, like,
Oh, this is my sound, yeah, you

know, so, and being around
people that lift you up too,

that's right, stretch you Yeah?
And it's okay, like, I feel

comfortable enough I try this,
man, you know,

yeah, it's a safe space. Yeah,
to do that, yep, Oh, yeah. I'm

always looking to play different
music and stuff. But I've

mentioned this on so many shows.
The tough part is finding that

front person that doesn't is not
swimming in ego and confront a

band can sing, is willing to do
it, you know, because this town

is all about I'm a solo artist,
and I've got some people in the

back wearing black. That's the
mentality. So,

so the network is the opposite
of that. Yes, we literally play,

I mean, horns to funk band, no
front person. Oh, everyone takes

turns singing. Someone will take
turns singing or will bring up

people. But it's, it's more
movements, it's funk music. So,

yeah, you know it's,

it's P funk. You're doing James
Brown, you're doing, we music,

we create. Oh, it's original.
It's

all original funk music. And we
were, I'm super proud of this,

because we were, like, one of
the we did, like a whiskey jam

residency at one point, and it
was like, for a whole month. Do

you guys have a record out? No,
we don't. We haven't even

recorded music yet, but it's
almost like the Trans Siberian

Orchestra model, yeah, lead
singers? No, I wanted to do and

it actually makes it very
awkward in an entertaining way.

Yeah, I lead the band. I'll and
we got the mic back

there telling jokes in between
songs and stuff. No, because I

don't like talking. Oh, I guess
it's weird, because, you know,

you give me a mic, we have a
great time.

I'm more like everybody laughing
because I leave, I lead the band

by like, whoo, and we've played
together so much, I would just

kind of, we have, like, a
strategic plan, yeah, and it's,

it's dance music. It's about a
vibe and moment? Well,

that needs to come back the the
experience of going out on a

Friday or Saturday night and
waiting in a line and getting

into a place, and then it's
standing room only, and the

people are it's mostly dancing
and it's sweaty, and it's like

the waitress is trying to come
through with the Martini,

spilling it all over the place,
and everyone's just sweaty. And

you. Heck, yeah, that's, that's,
that's, that was the goal. That

sounds like a good time, yeah?
And it's kind of like the

opposite of everything else,
yeah, well, I mean,

like, Look at this. I'm looking
at this track record. Were you

on that KEB mo record with Keo?
That was key.

I did make the record, but you
played live, but I've played

with Kevin, a ton. He lives

around here, right? Yeah, he's,
man, I'm a brilliant dude. I

mean, I love that, that theme
song of Mike and Molly,

yeah, he's great. Oh God, Adam
Lambert, yeah, yeah. What was

that stuff? A Little Big Town

Oak Ridge Boys, yeah. They came
out. Opry,

Jana Kramer, I toured with Jana

for a little bit. Hunter Hayes,
what happened to Hunter man,

man,

Hunter, so fun story. I was just
a fan of Hunter man, like,

Hunter is a phenomenal musician,
if people don't

know, it's kind of like a
country John Mayer, kind of next

level, right? Like the next
level up. Seriously, yeah. And I

was a fan of his. And one day we
were doing, like, I was playing

with little, big town, and we
were doing awards, and he was

kind of doing, like, you know,
they have, like, if you go to

Vegas, like, the amas used to be
there or something like that,

yeah. But he was doing, like, a
side show, and he was, he only

brought in his MD, and it was a
house band, yeah. And I was

like, I'm gonna go over there
and watch Hunter. So I'm

watching him rehearse. And I'm
like, Man, this is not his vibe.

And he looked at me, and I had
met him before, and I was just

joking. I'm like, bro, I know
all your songs. He's like, what

you want to play. He's like,
because this is, this is so bad

dude in the middle of, like,
getting ready for little big

time on, on, like, playing live
TV. I went to my hotel, and just

like he gave me what he's gonna
play, we played, like a, like a,

probably a 60 minute set,
crushed it. He was like, bro,

that was phenomenal. Is this

during the Steve Sinatra, after

after, right after, that's right
after. So I started working with

him like he would bring me in
every once in a while. And I got

a call one day from his MD, my
buddy Andy Sheridan. He's like,

Hubert Hunter is about to go
into the new year, man, and he

needs a whole new band. It was
like, right when Steve had left

for good and and I was like,
dude, well, don't call anybody.

I gotta. I got a band. He's
like, what? I'm like, yeah, man,

I just started my own band. It's
called the network. We're a funk

band, but I think you're gonna
like these guys. And he's like,

Well, when can I hear him? And I
was like, tomorrow. He's like,

all right, where I'm like, my
buddy's garage. And he showed

up. I called my friends, but got
to the band, like, Yo, we got to

get together tomorrow. We didn't
have rehearsal, so he showed up,

drove his very nice car in East
Nashville, parked in front of

the garage. Hunter Hayes sits in
the corner. We just played

through a couple songs that we
and he said, Call me back that

night. I want the whole band.
Obviously, I'm like, Man, I

little, big town is really great
for me right now. So he took

that band on the road. And I
call one of my buddies from

Chicago because he's a young
drummer. You probably know him

now. He's phenomenal. Dude named
Dez is black drum hippie on

Instagram. Black drum hippie,
yeah, I follow him. So when he

was younger, I met him in
Chicago. He's like, Dude, I want

to play country music. I'm like,
but you got to join the circus,

bro. I got friends in town.

That's branding. Oh, I know the
black drum hippie,

yeah. So he, I, he came and
stayed with me for the audition,

and I gave him some like, dude,
go play these drums and do it

like this. He, he's, I did not
tell him how to play because

he's elite on drums, yeah, but,
uh,

the network, yeah, sounds great.
Well, you next, next step is a

record for you guys, or, yeah,
live record.

Yeah, that'd be fun. We so we've
done Hunter, actually, because

he loves the band. He recorded
us. We did like a thing at

Rudy's, and he recorded like a
version of it, yeah? He just

loves the bands, because he
ended up touring with those guys

for a couple years. Awesome.
Yeah,

see now you're you're a net,
you're a connector. Yes. I mean,

you set those guys up for
success, yes. And now they're

all a job. Now

they all play for the bass
player plays it Lauren and Elena

Colton, oh, yeah, yeah. And then
the keys player, Jonathan plays

brothers Osborne. Now, yeah,
those Adam on Adam box. That's

my brother. I love that dude.
Yeah, you want to talk about

that's my spirit animal. Man,
yeah,

you know what I gotta I gotta
apologize to you. I It sounds

like we were off to a really,
really great start together, and

I haven't seen you in years.
Man, oh, man. So I'm just, I've

just been a bad friend. No,

it's all, it's all good because
I was always watching from you,

man, I'm just happy. I'm

just happy that you're doing the
thing. You got a healthy life,

healthy family, you got a rock
solid gig celebrating 10 years.

You know, your build. You got
this side hustle. You got your

speaking thing happening. I
think the I think the book is

next. You write a book gives you
a little bit more credibility.

Phone will ring a little bit
more. Or, you mean, you're

totally credible. Anybody in the
world would be happy to have

you. But there's something about
trying to get five books under

your butt. I want to just kind
of shoot for five, man heck,

shoot for 50. But, you know, I
got three out. Put out another.

You know, they say, get the five
if you can. You know, five

books, and then people can
stumble across you're like, oh,

published author, Amazon
bestseller, just one more little

feather in your cap. And they
go, how much do you need? And it

just justifies it.

You know what's interesting?
I've had this huge defensive

posture towards the first book,
yeah, but when you said five, it

it almost like released me from
it like, Hey, I'm going for five

The first one's fine.

Hey, look at Grant Cardone. We
thought when we interviewed

Grant Cardone, he said, You know
what, man I was, I didn't want

to be paralyzed by this. Just he
I said, just there. He says the

first book had typos. It just
get it out. He

said, It's a best selling book,
not a best written book.

Just get it out. And then just
content, content, content. Gary

V. I was telling, uh, Jim the
other day, I reposted something

for Gary V. I thought it was
some cool little quote he had

scribbled on a napkin. Hit me
back man, on a DM said, great

work. Keep building. You know
what I mean? I'm like, so good

man. I needed that. I needed
that kick. Because sometimes I'm

sometimes I feel like, Oh, my
God, I'm going to be, you know,

going to be 55 years old. I can
live in a 55 and older

community. I'm going to be
driving around a golf cart. You

know, are my best days behind.
You know what I mean, you get

this, they're not man, I've got
energy. I've got ideas. You

know what Gary would say to you?
He'd look at you and go, and he

just go like, he's like, okay,
you've done all this, and that's

right. And just keep going.
That's right. Just keep going.

You know? So remember your
purpose? 2025 you know my

purpose? Statement, real easy.
My purpose in life is to affect

people in a positive way and
change lives. One sentence, do

you have a sentence?

I don't know of a sentence, but
what

about couple sentences? I'll say
this,

and I wish

it's very simple. I

want to be Christ. Like, I

want to be Christ. Like, well,
that's better than mine. It's

the highest it's the highest
form of high performance. Like,

like, I don't know if it's the
Holy Well, it probably is the

Holy Spirit. But when I look at
how Christ moved, that is the

highest form of high
performance. That's Jordan,

that's COVID. That's, yeah,
that's LeBron. That's LeBron,

yeah. I mean his principles, the
way that he moved, the grace,

his convictions. And I think,
you know, for me, like going

back into the Word and being
like, you know, I don't want to,

I don't want to have a
perception of what I was told

about it. I want to, you know,
be breathed on every day and and

in a new season about what I'm
experiencing from the word like,

that's that will guide me on who
I should be helping. How do I

organize my skill set, and how
do I divide time between pouring

into my babies and and keeping
my wife on board, you know,

like, it's too complex for me to
create a mission that does it

all because it's impossible.
It's impossible. And I think

that sounds crazy to think that
impossible is a hopeful thing,

but it is because I know I'm not
alone, like, I got great

friends, yeah, great mentors,
amazing people who I look up to

that I might not talk to them
every day, but I glean from

them, right, like yourself. So
there's

something very powerful in, you
know, and Jim can attest to

this, you know, just the idea of
like, just release it to God,

you know what I mean? Just like,
just like, just, just, dude, lay

it at the foot of the cross.
Just, just, just like, it's,

it's good to know some to the
overachiever in me feels like

that's too easy. Yeah? Sounds
like work. It's got to be hard.

Yeah, sweaty. It's got to be the
sweat of your brow in 23 hour

days. And maybe not. Yeah,

maybe not. I mean, like, I do
want to share this because I

woke my wife up at like, 430 in
the morning the other day. So

hey, and I thought about this
idea, I was like, Babe, because

we were playing spades, it's a,
it's a real African American

family game, but my wife is not.
She was playing like over

Thanksgiving, and we and we were
playing, so spades is like a

partner game. It's two on two,
and you know, you're playing,

and it's super fun card game.
And I was like, hey, what you

don't realize is, okay, I have
13 cards. You're my partner.

Your cards are my cards. I just
can't see them. And I was like,

Hey, we all have a hand that
we're dope. And we have other

people in our life, our lives,
that have the other cards, but

we got to be open to hearing
from them, you know, being able

to delegate and being able to
trust other people with our

secret parts, being able to look
up to people without the ego

being in a way right,

trust people with our secret
parts. Oh my God, dude, I hope

you're right. You wrote it's all
down. It's going in your speech.

I hope you wrote all this down.
I

just thought about that, but
that's what an engagement.

Headline,

yeah, wow, Jim, ask your
question.

So you have to make a decision
for the rest of your life to

play in a tribute band, and
that's all you can do. There's

nothing else. It's too easy.
This is too easy. I love it.

What tribute band is it going to
be

for Dave Matthews Band? Oh my
god.

Dave Matthews Carter. We need to
get Carter on. Carter is

ambidextrous. Oh, rock Carter,
because

I went to boarding school and
and I was just trying to make

friends one night my freshman
year, and I walked into this

guy, he was from Ohio, and I
walked into his room, and he had

a stack of CDs at the time, and
I had my little CD player, and I

was just trying to make friends.
I'm like, Hey, man, what's man,

what's this? When it says band,
I just figured that it was live.

It was Dave Matthews Band live
at Red Rocks. Wow, man. I put

that CD in and in the way, and
then

the Huertas on the symbol and
the time and the snare, the

way it sounded, and and it was,
it was a blessing for me,

because that's what kept my fire
going from 14 to 18, when it was

all about football and yeah,
there was no music. I got under

the table and drumming and I had
the car.

Did you wear the skin tight
scuba gear and stuff like that?

I could pull that off. But he
was like, yeah, he

was the kangal guy at a point
like

the Jerry looked just like did
his chambers. Yes, pretty much

he basically, at the one point
he would wear hockey jerseys,

yes, and I did that for a while,
you know, because he did it. So,

yep, yeah, Carter, not
flattering, though. No, not at

all. My Courtney couldn't stand
me wearing those.

Hey, we're gonna do the Fave
Five. What's your favorite

color? Red. Nice. All right, so
many red drums, yeah, oh yeah.

Porsche red candy apple reds.
Porsche, Porsche, Porsche,

Porsche. Favorite food or dish?

Oh, a peach cobbler. My
grandmother used to make it

with, um,

cool whip or no, no Cool Whip.
Just naked,

yeah, just naked. All kinds of
crusts and peaches

and then with milk or coffee or
ice cream, milk would be good.

I never thought about that
vanilla ice cream that just

evokes something. Anyway,

I haven't tasted cow milk in so

long. I'm so lacto. It's rare
for me now, yeah,

it's favorite drink.

Favorite drink?

I like power eight and Gatorade.
Yeah, it makes me feel like I'm

doing something important.

Not the zero, not the zero. Is
probably

more healthy. But no, too

much, too many chemicals. What's
your favorite song at the

moment? Ooh,

or of all time,

ghost note has a song called
revival.

I saw those guys at pas two
years ago. They did a concert at

the percussive Art Society. And
all these you know, marimba

players and timpanists from
around the world dancing their

brains out to go snow.

Yeah? Robert sputzy, right, yes,
but is a hero, yeah? Um, his,

his grind, the way that he's
reinvented himself and like,

just like, all right, I'm the
funk guy now. Yeah, he's very

ambrodit, but he's super funky.
And it's a song called revival

on there. It's like, maybe track
seven or something on the last

have to check that out record,
but it's the tempo is really and

Travis toy from Rascal Flatts is
playing on it, solos on it.

Really, yes, crazy. It's great,
very, it's nuts.

Yeah, one time Travis um, filled
in on bass when we were opening

up for the rascal flats, because
totally had to go have a baby,

and he jumped up and played some
bass with us. Crazy, that guy.

We were only playing four songs,
Favorite movie of all time at

the moment, the program, Oh, I
saw it. I was trolling your

Facebook page. I went all the
way down. It's like, what else

can I learn about Hubert James
Khan? Yes, he's the coach,

right? Yes. So how have I Jim?
Have you seen this movie? I've

never seen this movie. I

have not seen him, the progress
cult

classic. And what's interesting
is, like with today's nio error,

like that movie is so important,
so important. It

in today's what culture in

IO, so now college athletes can
be paid legally. Oh yeah, yeah,

about time, yeah. And I'm, I'm,
I'm working in that space right

now, but that movie was about
before it was legal, and how to

build a program under the table
where the boosters were paying

guys and buying a car, and the
kind of culture that that

creates, and the dynamics of
college football and the

freshmen it's coming in. It's

an older movie, right? 70s,

80, maybe early 90s, actually.
So is it a thing

you watch over and over, like we
over and over. We'll watch like,

I'll watch alien over and over,
or Shawshank Redemption. Or,

what's the one for you, buddy?
Oh

gosh, there's so many of them. I
like Shawshank too. Yeah,

Shawshank. We watched that not
too long ago. But, I mean, for

me, it's anything of any of the
Marvel stuff. But,

oh yeah, he's a big Marvel guy.
Yeah.

I also like Count of Monte
Cristo. That story is just like,

I

like a good Monte Cristo
sandwich,

good Monte Cristo cigar, man. We
can talk, yeah, all day, but I

know you got a headlining show
to play tonight. Yeah, you got

to push into Nashville. You got
to find I'm sure they got some

parking set aside for you, right
this way, Mr.

Broadway veteran, right there?
No, I'm a Broadway veteran. I

know where to

park sweet spots. So it's so
nice to spend this time with

you, and I am very happy for
you, and very I appreciate

that. Thank you. Thank you.
Yeah, I wouldn't be me without

you. I mean,

I love to just be a part of your
story. Man, and people can hire

you. You're on ear gigs, right?
Your gigs,

I'm on air gigs yet now and and
reach out to me. Man, Huber,

pain, Instagram, uh, dealing
with things most wanted to talk

to you. I'm a coach. That's

the best way to get to you. It's
just at Hubert pain, yeah, on

Instagram, yeah, you guys heard
it here first, Jim, we're

batching. Man, I had so much
fun. Thank you. Now we get to go

to your company party. Yeah,
we're gonna hang out and have

some have some egg knock all

the stuff. We have eggnog, but
we might have hot chocolate, but

sometimes,

whatever it is, we're getting
into it. But Hubert, you're

welcome to

stick around as long as you
like. I appreciate

you guys having me. This is so

great. Sorry. It's so noisy

I can't hear it. It's fine.

Thanks again. But and to all the
listeners, thank you guys so

much for tuning in supporting us
all these years. Be sure to

subscribe, share, rate and
review. It helps people find the

show. We'll be here. We'll see
you next time. Thanks. Hubert,

thank you guys. Kim,

this has been the rich Redmond
show. Subscribe, rate and follow

along at rich redmond.com
forward, slash podcasts. You