The Rich Redmond Show

Unknown: Mike coming to you from
crash studios in Music City,

USA, Nashville. This is the rich
Redmond show. Today's guest,

legendary studio drummer,

and now rich Redmond. What's

up, rock and rollers, rich
Redman here. This is another

episode of the rich Redmond Show
coming to you from Music City,

USA. Jim McCarthy, my co host,
my co producer, how you doing?

Buddy? Doing? Well, hey, hey,
you play drums. I do every we've

established that you do a little
bit of voiceover, just a tiny

bit. Now, when you were learning
drums and you were playing along

the records, you for sure,
played along the tracks from our

next guest, most likely, yes,
and you know what he is. He is

one of the most recorded
drummers in history, responsible

for sales over 250

million units. Mr. Paul line,

yeah, right. All right.

Now, Paul, look at some of these
artists. Now, this is straight

from your wiki. These are some
folks you've played with. John

Williams, Doc severance in the
London Symphony, the Boston

Symphony, Tanya Tucker, Tom
Jones, Randy Travis, Peter said,

Neil Diamond, Faith Hill, Tim
McGraw, Lionel, Richie shine

Twain. List goes on and on. Is
that all? And if you guys look

for you drummers out there,
you're interested, you look up

on YouTube. Paul lime, Nashville
recording session you did for

Vic Firth. Very informative,
where you break down the

national number system and you
talk about demo recordings and

all that. And another one that's
great is the interview you

recently did with our buddy DOM
FAMU laro and look up Paul lime

la Nashville studio on the
sessions panel. That's a nice

conversation. Yeah, what a great
thing that that they started

back some time ago. Jules follow
up and yeah, that's it's pretty

incredible.

And you and I have been able to
accomplish we don't get to break

a lot of bread, but every time
that you and I get together, we

are breaking bread at like the
palm with Jules and her entire

team, the tough life. And I know
it's so past the bread, past the

wine, so fun. So you have a
background. We have a similar

background, in the sense that
I'm originally from Connecticut,

but then I moved to Texas in
1981 I went to El Paso Texas,

and then eventually I ended up
in Dallas, Texas, in Dallas,

yeah, now you're did a lot of
work in Tyler, Texas, right?

Well, did a lot of work in Tyler
growing up, I started working in

Robin Hood, Brian studio, when I
was 15 years

old. He said you were a human
metronome. Yeah. Well, yeah. We

were playing with our rock and
roll band at this this Tyler DJ

would have all the local bands,
and we were on stage at Bergfeld

Park, and Robin Hood, as that's
his real name, Robin Hood,

Brian's Robin Hood caught me
after we came off stage, and he

said, I was 15. He said, kid,
you got a metronome in your

head. How would you like to play
on records? And I went, I want

to play anywhere I can. And he
said, Can you be at my studio

Tuesday at 430 and I said, I'll
have to ask my mom to take me.

Yeah, that's great. So that's
where that started. And then

that was in, let's see. That was
in 66 so then, of course,

graduated from high school in 69
Jeannie and I got married in 68

so Gratz, we're at 51 years.

Hey, that's the same as my
parents. They sell her 51 years

together. And I That's great.
You know what? I got him, but

I'm the first born son, so I had
to really go big. I got him, two

nights, three days at the super,
super, like the what's a super

high end hotel chain, the
highest like Marriott. It's like

a four seasons

Motel Six

Milo Deering.

So I got them, I got I got my
dad a beautiful round of golf,

and my mom the spa package and
whatever, one, whatever food

they want to eat for two days.
And where was it at? And this is

going to be in Florida. They
live in Fort Myers. So there

it's in Naples. Naples.

Have you ever been to burn in
Naples when you're on tour? Now,

Rocky Patel has a great club. Go
there, and it's called Burn.

It's called Burn. Smoke is all
his Rocky Patel cigars? Oh,

yeah. Great cocktails. Great
food. Are you a cigar? Great

cigars. Yeah,

no. Now, how? Now? How often is
too much? How do you space it

out? Oh,

I only have a cigar, maybe once,
two or three times a month.

Okay, that's not bad, yeah? For
a while there I was like, I like

this. It was like two or three a
night, not a couple days in a

row. And you're like, I probably
shouldn't do this,

yeah? Well, at this point of our
lives, you know, having a little

cocktail and cigar and makes you
feel like somebody What's your

cocktail of choice? An old
fashioned

Okay, no. Goes out of style.
Yeah,

you steak guy too.

Yeah, yeah. I'm more of a, more
of a pork long guy. Oh, nice.

Okay, yeah, I think that's what
we had at the comes from the

German background, I guess the
palm that time.

Okay, so, so you're working for
Robin Hood, you're in Tyler,

Texas. You're getting all this
experience, that's right. And

then eventually, life takes you,
at 19 years old, to Los Angeles,

in Dallas, into Dallas, yeah.

So I started, of course, Robin
Hood. We did all the American

Airlines jangles and Exxon and
everything down in Tyler. And

then they knew of me from down
there. And Ron tut and who

you're, of course, very familiar
with, he was in Dallas, and

Larry hobarrack, who was an
arranger in Dallas and moved on

to LA and Larry was doing a lot
of things for ABC TV. He was for

the 68 comeback special. He was
musical director for Elvis and

and L and Ronnie, and had worked
with Larry mahobarak A lot,

yeah, and in Dallas, so Larry.
Larry called Ronnie, said,

You've got to come out for this
audition. And Ronnie, so I'm

working. But anyway, he went
out. Of course, he got the Elvis

gig that was in 68 and so 68
6970 they were kind of hurting

in Dallas for a you know, a lot
of the guys there, out of out of

North Texas, jazzers, but
jazzers, you know, you know the

you know the drill. And I want
to move to New York and starve

type thing. So I don't want to
starve. I don't want to starve

So, but anyway, the so there was
kind of a hole in, in the in the

in the lineup in Dallas, and
when they found out I was

musical, I was band leader for a
chick singer there, Vicki

Britton, and we had our own
club, and it was doing going

really well. And so anyway, I
started working in the studios

in Dallas, then starting in
about 70. At 70, I moved to

Dallas and right out of high
school and and started working

the studios in 70 and then by 73
I was I was doing 450 sessions a

year in Dallas and and the guys,
Doc Severinsen had used the

Dallas rhythm rhythm section,
rhythm Dallas rhythm section to

to do Boston Pops and Cincinnati
Symphony and stuff like that. So

I went with, started with Doc
severance. And when I was 23

fantastic nice. It was, it's
been the angels in my life have

been unbelievable. Yeah, yeah.

Happened at the right time, and
I heard you mentioned your

angels. Those are some life
defining moments for you.

Yeah, yeah. Those those people
that come into your life and

believe in you more than even
you

do. Sure. I think Jim is one of
those guys. For me, he's been

like a spirit whisperer for the
last decade. Thank you. Yeah,

man, you know you've got to get
outside of your shell sometimes

and get that third party
perspective. Because you know

what? Sometimes we look in the
mirror, we don't always see what

the rest of the world sees. So
now again, you were in Los

Angeles during the heyday where
you were doing tons of session

for episodic television, your
Battlestar galacticas, and even

played on Star Wars The Return
of the Jedi. I mean, that would

be way up there for me. Guys, I
played on

Star Wars. Yeah, the music said
Revenge Of The Jedi. And why I

didn't grab it? I have no idea.
Just, it was just another

session, right? But now that I
look back, I had completely

forgotten I did it. And we were,
we were somewhere out with, I

think, without, with Mike
Nesmith from the monkeys and and

this kid came wandered
backstage, and he wanted to meet

me backstage. So of course, we
had him come backstage and we

talked, man, I learned how to
play hi hat from you on Star

Wars. And I'm going, did I do
that? Yeah, I remember that with

John. It was kind of a throw
together thing. And Jerry hay,

course, and did the horn
arrangement on it that he did

all the horn arrangements for
Michael Jackson, right? And on.

And I went

to school with Henry hay, his
son. Oh, no kidding, yeah. Oh,

great. And then he went to New
York to play jazz, and I think

he ended up going on to play
with some big folks, like the

stings of the world.

Oh, good. Yeah, that's
wonderful, crazy, right? Yeah,

you know, we've really got a
pretty small business. We all

know each other. We all love
each other, especially the

drumming community. It's, it's
really, we all support each

other

more than any other instrument
community. I think

probably so, yeah, I don't, I
don't know why that is, maybe

because we like beating on
things I don't

we do. So now, so you're out in
Los Angeles. What? What years

was that I moved to Los Angeles,
January the 15th, 1977

I love you have the date,
because I don't have the date of

when I moved to Nashville. I
just know it was March of 1997

Yeah, I, actually, I prayed a
lot about that at the time. I

prayed about, you know, and I
got this, I got this kind of

word, you know, you gotta, you
gotta be there by January the

15th. And so we drove, I drove,
actually. I drove all night long

to get I drove 24 hours to be in
the city limits by the 15th.

So Dallas, Los Angeles, Dallas
to Los Angeles, and you have

pickup truck

for your drive. I had a 72 Chevy
station wagon with the woody,

with the stuff the woody, the.
Video, the wood paneling, wood

paneling, yeah, and the roll
down back window

and all that stuff. It's like
Chevy Chase in Christmas.

Now, were you married at this
time? Were you a married man at

this time? Or, yes, okay, yeah.
And you've been able to provide

for a family playing the drums.
This is the American dream.

Yeah, it's

you and I. Both are one of the,
some of the fortunate ones. Yes,

it's like, I say it's one thing
is just rolled into another.

Within two weeks, when I got
there, the guitar player from

one of our high school rock and
roll bands, Doug Rohn, was with

Neil, and when I moved out, I
went out first myself, so I

lived with he and another high
school buddy. And where

are you crashing? Over there in
the Southland, what we're part

of El Malibu and Malibu, it's a
tough life. That's not bad.

No, they had a great pad Malibu,
yeah? And Frank is, can you

anyway? So, yeah, trencis, yeah.
So we saw, I was out there with

them, and within two weeks, I
was with Neil Diamond,

beautiful. That just, you know,
it's that stuff. You can't make

it up, yeah? Cuz

I'm kind of looking at your just
kind of the background here. I

even saw that you play with, I
worked with a gentleman named

Tim rush low, and we had a pop
country band called rush low,

yeah. And I saw, if you guys
want to look up on the YouTube

and attraction, just look up
2017 Trump inaugural, the ball,

Freedom ball. And you're playing
some great big band music with

Tim rush. Load, love Big Band
always rush, yeah, he's such a

nice guy. He's does it really
well. So here's some of the

films you worked on, Star Wars,
Return of the Jedi you did for

television, the fall guy,
Spencer for hire, growing pains.

You were the staff drummer on a
lot of award shows. Did

the American Music Awards for 10
years and the CMAS for off and

on for 25 years. ACMA is for,
yeah, 12

years, and you were the eight
time ACM drummer of the year.

And also sitting in that chair
there, we had two other winners.

We had Mr. Eddie bears and Mr.
Lonnie Wilson. Stop all of the

contemporaries. So when I moved
here in 97 I was doing my

research, and, you know,
researching everybody, so I

listened to a lot of your
tracks. Greg Morrow, Eddie

bears, Lonnie Wilson, Chad
Cromwell, Kenny had a kit here.

Was working a lot back in the
days, and I took a lesson from

him in nine. When did I take a
lesson 98 or something like

that? And then he said, You know
what? I'm just gonna move,

finally move out of his Indiana
house. And he says, I just

grabbed all my drums on the way,
and I just went to LA and now he

uses that as his base. Yeah,
does a lot of recording just

from a little spot in North
Hollywood. I'm just, is Kenny

out there? Now he's out there a
good 10 years or so. Is he

really?

Yeah, gosh, I didn't realize
he'd he'd moved out there that

long ago, because we do stay in
touch. I just didn't ask about

where he was living. There's a
great story that I have about

Kenny Aaron off, who's who we're
talking about. Now, my son, 20

years ago, was trying to decide
he was a senior at UT, and he'd

always wanted to fly jets and
but he played drums in his rock

and roll band, and they were the
hot band on campus up at

University of Tennessee, so they
were having a lot of fun, and he

was trying to decide whether to
follow in my footsteps. He was a

big fan of Kenny and and Ronnie
Tut. He our families, our family

and Ronnie's family grew up
together, and Jacob and Nathan

tut were best of friends, and,
and looks like extended family.

And so, so, so, so Kenny called
me. Was in town. He said, Hey,

Paul, you want to go get lunch?
So, yeah, man, Sure, that'd be

great. I got some time this
afternoon. So I said, You mind

if I bring my son? So we met
down at the old Houston's,

right? And, and so we're sitting
there, and we, you know, kibitz

bit and so he finally says to
Jake. He says, So Jacob, so

Jake, what's going on with you?
He says, man. He says, I'm a

senior at UT, and I either have
to sign for my commission this

week, I have to sign for my
commission in the Air Force.

I've been doing ROTC, and I've
got a sign for my commission the

Air Force, or turn that down and
follow in Ron's and dad's

footsteps and and start my, you
know, be get serious about a

music career. And I just, I'm
having such a hard time whether

to fly jets or play drums. And
Kenny reached over, slapped him

on the arm, said, Oh, man, go
fly jets. You can play drums

anytime, just like that. Made up
his mind. Yep, Kenny made up his

mind. And now in August, this
coming August, in eight months,

he retires. After 20 years, he's
retired with full pension, full

good for him, full medical is
when and he's gonna wants to

come back to start playing. If
you can talk about it, I

actually talked to him about it.
I said, Are you going to want to

come back to play? He said, I'm
getting so many great offers

with companies coming out of
them. Yeah, what he's an expert

at?

Yeah, I got an uncle that drove,
flew the planes for air,

American Airlines for years, and
when you know they have to

retire. Think at 6065, at 60 and
so he and he's just like, I'm

I'm good man, this is gonna be
fantastic. We're talking to our

friend Russ Miller one time, and
he's like, Rich. Do you realize

that the level of success you've
achieved, if it was in any other

industry, you would own a top
floor penthouse in Manhattan?

That's right, but it doesn't
work like that. No one doesn't,

not in the creative

arts. No, yeah, we do. Well, I
mean, we do. We're very

comfortable. And I can retire if
I want to, but I still love it,

you know, I still enjoy it, and
we stay busy, yeah,

speaking of staying busy and
having a great skill set, the

School of Rock, School of Rock,
right here in Nashville,

Tennessee. I remember when I
was, you know, learning the

drums. It was 1976 1977 I had
super supportive parents, and

Too bad we didn't have something
like the School of Rock. The

School of Rock is a great thing.
There's 250 locations in the

world, and right here in
Nashville and Franklin, we have

two of the best locations, Kelly
and Angie McCarthy. You know

him. You love him. You met him.
We interviewed him. They run the

best school of rocks. And so if
you got a kid out there that

wants to learn the drums, bass
guitar, keyboards, they want to

sing, they can take lessons at
the School of Rock. And even if

your kids never become a full
time musician, they're going to

learn about persistence,
determination, time management,

working well with others, taking
direction. And those are great

skills to have in life. So I got
two emails addresses for you,

Nashville at School of Rock
calm, or Franklin at School of

Rock calm, tell him I sent you.
And thank you so much School of

Rock for sponsoring the rich
Redmond show. Yes. Thank you

very much. We're so good at
that. Oh, dude, thanks. I got a

future in radio. I better get on
it. You know,

that's another industry that if
you really do well in it's

seemingly you should own a
penthouse, but exactly doesn't

happen.

Should become like, you know,
Howard Stern, or Don Imus or

something like that. Yeah, it's
lightning in a bottle. I love

listening. I listened to that
interview you did with Dom

family Laura last night, and you
were talking about your first

drum hero, Louis Bellson Louie
bells, you know, mine was, it

was a gateway drug. I really
enjoyed Carmine apathy. And we,

you know, we kind of become
friends over the years, and then

looking back, you find out, Oh,
Carmine was really into Gene

Krupa and everyone's like,
buddy, rich man all the way, no

Krupa all the way. It's like,
you got your chocolate and my

peanut butter. You got my peanut
butter and your chocolate,

that's right. I thought that
that gene had such a great

showmanship. And he was the
people's

drummer, yeah, he was the
people's drummer. And he was,

yeah, right, that's it, yes.
That's the best way I can think

of to put him Yeah, people's
drummer. Technically, Buddy.

Buddy had him. Oh yeah, yeah.
But he had everybody. But you

know, his talking to Ron one
time. You know the opener for,

for the opener that

Ron used, Elvis wanted the drums
to start the whole show, sure.

And so the opener that Ron used
on CC Ryder, it's a straightened

out version of Sing, sing, sing,
sing. And Ron is right, yeah,

there's even there triple it in
the whole thing. And he actually

doesn't use the, he actually
doesn't use the two bass drums

on the open when I do the show I
I do. I had him in the second

two bars, just make it thunder a
little more. Oh,

so you're on the toms, and then
on bar three and four, you had

the feet. Add the feet, yeah,

yeah. It's fun showing we do it.
But yeah, Ron, when Ron was had

conflict, because Ron, after,
after the 80s, I wanted to stay

in the studios with Neil. I want
to stay in the studios in LA and

kind of work with everybody.
Now, when

you move to Lawson, and when you
moved to Nashville in 19 in 1988

was that, let's go to a
something like a little bit more

of a slower, a softer pace to
raise children? Was that the

thing?

Well, Lee had called me to to go
out with James Taylor, nice. And

I'd always wanted to play with
James and and one night, I told

my two little boys, Jacob and
Josh, one that's now retiring

from the Air Force, that's
crazy. I said, you know, Daddy's

gonna take a, you know, I really
want to play with this artist.

And I'd already, I'd already
turned down Neil full time and

and we were, I was in the middle
of doing a Lionel Richie there

should have been around 81 and
we 81 and we were still, we

started doing all the Lionel
Richie records and and Lee Sklar

called to do, to do James. And,
man, I'd love to do that. That'd

be awesome. So I told the kids
one night, and they were, let's

see 81 Jacob would have been
about four. They boys are about

three and four. And I said, you
know, I'm, I want to, I'm gonna

go on tour. I'm gonna do a
little traveling. You know, I've

been home, just in the studio,
and being home every night.

Well, Daddy, how long you gonna
be gone? I said, Well, it's a

year. Well, Daddy, how long is a
year? Well, it's Christmas to

Christmas. You know, how long
Christmas to Christmas is to a

four year old? Long time.
Forever. Yeah, yeah. And they

start crying, and I'll go, Well,
I'm not leaving tomorrow. It's

okay. So, you know, you go back
and put Jeannie. Should I do? I

really want to, but I don't want
to leave the kids. And so first

day of rehearsal, I was walking
out the door, and they started

crying, and Jeannie started
crying, then I started crying,

and I called Lee, and I said,
Lee, I can't do this. I can't go

and he said, and I thought he
was gonna lie. Said, I

understand. I thought he was
gonna light into you. He said,

he said, Paul, man, thank Thanks
for telling me now. He said,

Thanks for he said, because,
man, you know, sometimes guys

can't take the road and have
families. They get out for a

month and they and they say, I
gotta go home. Yeah. And I've

had, I've had guys do that to me
before as a band leader. But

here's, here's the end of that
story that happened 30 years

later at the White House. We're
in the we're in the East Wing of

the White House, and we're doing
the the country at the White

House TV special for Obama, and
James is on stage, and we're

we'd already rehearsed and
everything I gave him the very

last I gave James Taylor very
last of my last serial number of

my signature snares. Yeah, but
anyway, because he came back

said, was that snare drum? And I
said, That's my signature snare

what's, what's different about
this drum? Anyway, I'm getting

off

track. That's one of the best
selling signature snare drums.

Yeah, they're

going up on the on the eBay, on
eBay.

But anyway, so we're in the East
Wing of the White House, and

James is standing there. We have
a little bit of a break. And so

I told him the story that, of
course, he didn't even know

about. He don't you know, Lee
was the band leader, putting the

band together and, and I don't
think James knew about it. And I

told him the story, and he went
really and then 15 minutes

later, he came back and he said,
I didn't get all that. He said,

Paul, tell me that. Tell me that
story again. And I told him what

had happened. He said, You made
the right choice.

Ah, it seems like a super, kind
soul. Oh, James,

a great deal. Diamonds, great
guy. Some of them are not.

Who were some of the other folks
that you had a touring

relationship with over the
years, Linda, Linda Hamilton,

no. Linda Carter. Most recently,
she thinking of Terminator. My

very first, my very first
episodic TV series was Wonder

Woman, nice and and we had, you
can go online and see that Linda

Carter CBS specials, you can see
all that stuff and some great

shots on that. But that was we
had. We did five CBS specials,

and she actually started as a
singer, and so we hooked back.

We hadn't talked for, like, 28
years, and back in oh eight, she

called and said she wanted to
come back. She'd raised her kids

want to come back to working. So
I've been MD for Linda now for

this will be our going on our
13th year. Great. So, yeah, so

it's a lot of but we only do
about 1515, 20 dates a year, and

just just enough to get out and
have some good food. And that's

nice. You hear the crowd? Yeah?
That kind of stuff. It's fun

stuff. Yeah. I remember

in 9097, when I moved to town,
it was very it was very there

was very much a line in the sand
where you were an artist or a

songwriter, or you were a
session drummer, or you were a

live drummer, and there wasn't a
lot of commingling. And then

that's right. And then now that
things have changed, you're

really smart to I know all of
our colleagues are jumping in a

bunk on the weekends and riding
on a bus doing sessions Monday

through Thursday, and like,
Yeah, I'll go play with Amy

Grant, yeah, I'll go play with
Bob Seger, yeah, go play with,

you know, that's it's become the
norm now, yeah, as as the, as

our, the business as we know it.
And, you know, yeah, has turned

into what it's turned into with,
with so much the business model

having pretty much been
destroyed. Yeah, you know,

thanks a lot for the mp three
guys, yeah, really destroyed it.

And they have the thing. They
could

have stopped it, and they
didn't, but, but, yeah, touring

relationships Tom Jones was just
an absolute ball. I did that in

77 when I first after working
with Neil, and before the kids

came, I went out with Tom Jones
and nice. So much fun. Yeah,

yeah, it's that's about as much
fun as you can have, right? With

that, with

your clothes on,

he's just, he's such a rocker,
you know, we do his show, and

then he'd get on the on the
plane, he'd have private chat.

We he and hopefully hitting the
back of the seats as he walked

to the back of the jet gun come
along a baby. Whole lot of shake

and go. He's still ready to go.
Yeah, yeah. So all fired up. All

Fired up, yeah, we would, but
each both of us would lose five

pounds. Have you ever weighed
yourself before you go on? Weigh

yourself when you

come off. Now, I had a girl I
can probably get you connected

with. She weighed, you know, she
put these elect she put some

electrodes on me. She's actually
doing a scientific study over

five years. That's a good one
too. And so I burn 1000 calories

a show. Oh, yeah, 90 minute
show. So 1000 calories and my

heart's up there. Yeah?

Now, so it's good. We're getting
paid to work out. Oh, that's

right, yeah, that's easy to keep
we lose

that water weight for sure,
though, because I. When I come

off, it's like, my shirts, like,
wring it out, yeah, I should

turn it into, like, a perfume or
a cologne. Yep, I

have a question. You talked
about the every man's drummer

being Gene Krupa. I've always
taught. I always thought of Neil

Peart like that. Yeah, you know,
kind of like everybody knew who

he was. Thought he was one of
the best drummers. But of

course, technical prowess,
you've got guys that could, you

know, drum circles around him,
but to the every man, he was an

amazing drum household, amazing.

You know, Rush. Rush was like a
religion. It's, it's like,

you're either a huge rush fan,
right? Or you're not. But

certainly, anybody who was a
huge rush fan, obviously, you

know, Neil. So there was

a documentary recently that I
watched, and I want to say it's

on one of the streaming channels
that you can you can download,

and it's about them leading up
to their very last show, and

they documented. It was very
well done. That's great. And the

attitudes within the band,
because Getty and Alex, they

weren't ready to hang it up. But
Neil was like, Guys, I'm gonna

be 64 years old. I'm getting
tired. He's like, I can't play.

That was, that was big of him

to admit that, you know, yeah,
he wanted

to go out on top. You know, it
was, it was one of those things

that I kind of appreciated about
him, that it's just that he's

like, it's a workout.

Do you feel like you're gonna
die with the sticks in your

hand. Is that a goal? One, two?

You know what I mean? That's
probably what

I'll do. I want to play as long
as I still love it. Yeah, I want

to play as long as I still love
it and and I still love it. So

I'm only taking what I really
want to do if it's really fun. I

we got a call today, this
morning that Tanya, Tanya Tucker

and I great buds, and she wants
to, we're going to do a remake

of Delta dawn, and they're
trying to find as many originals

as possible. And so we're a
couple weeks we're going to

recut Delta Dawn and and Miss
Brenda is going to come in.

Brenda Lee is going to come in
and be part of it, so that'll be

a lot of fun. And, you know,
talking about everyday drummer

and every man's drummer, Louis
fit to me, Louis was technically

beyond. He was, he was kind of
in the middle between buddy and

Gene, yeah, and so. But he was
he, he did the double bass drums

for the first time and and when
I heard that, it just at 12

years old. I was just because I
was beating, like every other

drummer that I was beating on
everything in the house. I knew

how sharp to sharpen the
pencils, but where the tips

wouldn't break, but they'd still
bounce well in school, right?

Yeah. And so it just, I mean,
I've always heard rhythms in

everything and and I think
that's, I think that's

exceptionally important to young
players, to know the lineage.

Know, who did Louis Bellson
listen to? Well, he gene was

older than he was, so he had
listened to Gene, you know, and

and, and then, and then I told
you the story about Ronnie. He

was a gene fan, right? So Ronnie
kind of he. Ronnie had his own

style, but Ronnie was one of the
first ones to meld rock and roll

and orchestra. And that's,
that's my favorite thing to do,

is play with a a rock and roll
rhythm section, with a full

orchestra, kicking a full
orchestra, a big band is that's,

that's my favorite thing to do,
although, in Nashville, you

know, when we moved here in 88
there, there was not that much

of that to do until when we
started to do the CMA Christmas

specials. All of that's big
band. Well, most of it's big

band. And we've been doing, we
just had our 10th, finished our

10th year of the CMA Christmas
specials. I'm at 10 years with

that now.

So it's like, we have this
calendar every year the things

we can look forward to, there's
like, CRS, CMA Music Fest, and

then there's the CMAS and the
ACMs, and then you get into all

your Christmas specials, and
then all the sessions in

between, it's like, we got the
NAM show, we got pas we get this

whole thing that kind of we can
look forward to.

Yeah, I'm pretty much booked for
the rest of year as much as I

want to be as four trips to
Europe. And it's, it's gonna be

a lot. Who's the

gentleman you're playing? Is he
an Elvis impersonator? He's not

an

impersonator. Those are the guys
who wear the the jumpsuits.

Yeah? And we won't work with
them. The TCB guys won't work

with them. It just that. It's
just awkward, didn't Yeah, but,

but guys that do a great job and
really honor Elvis and the fan

clubs in Europe are still
ravenous for his music, right?

And because he was such a
tremendous artist, such a great

singer. He did a lot of covers.
I mean, he covered a lot of

stuff, especially later on in
life, when he wasn't getting the

top shelf stuff anymore because
of the way the colonel handled

his business. But, but

who played on all the
soundtracks for the Elvis

movies? It was

buddy Harmon and DJ Fontana.
Wow. We lost the. J That's

almost a year ago now. I stay in
touch with pre Hal Blaine. Halb

played pretty on the on the
stuff in LA and he played on the

on the TV specials. DJ was on
all the movies and but when they

would do the movies, they would
also Elvis would fly buddy out

buddy Harmon. So it'd be buddy
and DJ, and sometimes be three

drummers on a lot of them, like
the Beach Boys records, there's,

there's, there's two drummers
and two percussionists. And, I

mean, it's just yeah, as a
matter of fact, if, if you were

able, if you were able, to see a
credits sheet on Viva Las Vegas.

It's, it's buddy Harmon, DJ
Fontana, Louie Bellson, wow, and

gosh, who was the other drummer
that was on it? And it might

been hell as well. Yeah, yeah.
Four full on drummers. Yeah. So

when you listen to it, like,
see,

yeah, to our coffee, to our non
drummers out there. Buddy Harmon

was a national session drummer
that played on, I believe,

18,000 recording sessions. And
when I was starting to play the

Grand Ole Opry in the in the
9798 99 he'd be hanging out. He

was always at the opry hanging
out. Like just that was his

life, yeah. And Hal Blaine was
probably the first and perhaps

last session drummer to own
Rolls Royce's mansions and

yachts. But he liked the ladies

when they were still cheating.
He was married six times,

but the yachts and the Rolls
Royce, he

was married six times. God, rest
his soul.

Take a piece of paper. Cut it in
half, yeah, cut it in half

again. Cut it in half again,
right?

Yeah, in half. And he ended up
having to sell half again

records. He had to sell his gold
records

to a limb. Yeah, it's, it was,
it was terrible. I stayed in

touch with him at the at the
end, yeah?

Hal Blaine, yes. He was always
quick with a joke. So friendly.

That's, that's really part of
the equation is, yeah. Your

reading shops together, and you
got to know your electronics,

and you got to be able to play
with a click and tune your drum

and take direction, but at the
same time, really, it's like

that those your personality and
your people skills in in the

room, and how you can deal with
people and and how was probably

the first one to show up and had
his coffee and a cigarette, and

he had the new joke of the day,
and people loved being around

the guy and

represent Have you seen the
movie Love and Mercy? No. Would

you see that movie? It's about
Jim's always good for tuning us

on the good movies. Well, I
mean, it's a movie all about

man. What's his name? Brian
Wilson, yeah. And Hal Blaine,

there's a, you know, actor in
that movie that plays Hal blame.

Yeah, we're

friends on Facebook, that me and
that actor, and we've been

trying to get together for four
years for coffee. Yeah, but

there's a lot of urban sprawl,
sprawl in Los Angeles, so I

split my time. I live with my
girlfriend in West Hollywood,

and when I'm not here, and it is
so fun. Did you find that when

you moved from Los Angeles, you
missed the Thai Lebanese and

Greek food on every street
corner, sushi, you're here.

Like, wow, where's barbecue?

We miss shondara, yeah, Shonda,
the Thai food there at kawanga

in the sunset. Yes, I love
shandar. We used to eat there

almost everything. I think it's
a, it's a, it was right beside

group four

things like a Katsuya. Now, no,
Chandra still, still there.

Okay, I'm gonna go

when we go out, we, when we go
out with Linda, we play the

Catalina club out there to get
her ready for Kennedy Center and

Lincoln Center. And did he
Catalina close Catalina club on

Sunset? Yeah, still there.
Catalina Bar and Grill still

there. Okay, yeah, but that's a
it's a fun little venue

to play so many jazz clubs
closed, man, but the baked

potato is still rocking. The
potatoes

still going. There's a place out
in West Lake where our kids were

born, bogeys.

Is it bogeys? Bogeys, bar I
think it's bogeys, bogeys,

bogeys, yeah. And then there's
the write off room that our

buddy. Do you know, Tony
bronickle, I don't know the

session drummer. He played with
Ken Moe for years. He played

with Bonnie. Great. He's
actually the guy that recorded,

I can't make you love me with
the brushes on the Bonnie Raitt

song. They could, they couldn't
get a take for whatever reason

he heard the song. He came in
one passer like, that's it.

Boom. That's great. Yeah. I love
those stories. So what are you

most excited about? What have
you learned along the way?

What's your next five years look
like?

Oh gosh,

because, you know, there's going
to be musicians that, not even

drummers, but other
instrumentalists, people that

want to get record deals. You
know, you've survived and

thrived in four decades of the
music business, five decades of

the music business. What are the
commonalities? What are some

things that, some advice that
you could give to these

dreamers? Drum roll,

I had to do that was good. It
was effective.

The comedy is, tell. Timing,
anticipate,

yeah, once again, if you want to
be a if you when, when

technology started coming into
drum, drum world in in the 80s,

late 70s and early 80s. A lot of
the guys, Hal and Ronnie, did

not embrace it. They did not
want to really take the trouble

to learn that. And what we had
to do is we had to figure out

how to use a lindron. We had to
figure out how to trigger an SDS

five and an SDS seven. And why
didn't the SDS seven sound like

the SDS five? And when the SDS
five was so popular at the time,

but we all knew that was going
to move on to something else.

That's one thing I learned when
we did the Amy Grant Christmas

record with Tennessee, Tennessee
Christmas and all those things

on it that we cut it caribou
actually in July, as most of the

Christmas records you've got,
I'm sure, yes, as with me, you

do them in July, bells in July,
sleigh bells in July. So, so.

But I used the Simmons drums on
that. And I'll never use

electronics on a Christmas
record. What year was that? 82

so, because they go on
Christmas, records play for

everything. And you, yeah, you
hear that, you go, so you have,

like, 1982 I sound so freaking

old. So you had the you had the
Lynn, you had the octopad, you

had the the Simmons. And then
there's, we're

doing splitters coming we'd do
double splitters coming out of

the back of the lindrum, and
you'd get that sound. And just

that, then that would run
through a a, basically a limiter

that would just pull the spike
off the top of the sound, where

you could go into a four out of
16 or or some other thing. Maybe

you double and trick, you know,
up triggering more drums and

that kind of stuff. All my
drums. I put piezos on all the

drums so you just plug into the
shell. Still to this day, no,

no, no anymore. Now you know all
the engineers want to run the

world, so let them do the let
them do everything. It's so easy

to show up. Hell yeah, so, but
what? What that created was a

playing situation where you had
to in order to know you were

firing everything. The dynamics
went out of the kit, which I

really miss. But then I get used
to just slamming all the time.

And then I realized when I quit
triggering, that you don't have

to play that way all the time,
right? And if you play you're

playing through the heads. It's
it's too far totally. So, so

yeah, but looking forward to the
next five years. Gosh, I I'm

enjoying life. I've got, I've
got, my three kids are very

successful. I've got seven great
grandkids. We're, we're trying

to spend more time with them.
And are they all here in this

area, Middle Tennessee?
Actually, my first son's in

Vegas. He's still at Nellis.
He'll be getting out of the Air

Force, and he's trying to decide
whether to move back here.

Second son is a professor of
theology and at Whitworth

University in Spokane, and our
daughter does live here, just

about three minutes from us, and
we have the grandkids over at

the house all the time. They
love being in Opus house. That

is awesome. It's a great life.
We've gene are still together

and and very thankful. That's

a great victory, right there.
Marriage is tough, especially

when you're in the arts and
you're traveling, and you keep

your schedule like you

keep Yeah, so it's but a lot of
times I fly southwest, so much,

she flies with me companion, so
she fries for free. So she loves

that. She goes.

I know there's less there's less
bells and whistles on Southwest,

but I'm a Southwest man because
they I just I find that they're

the kindest, funniest, happiest
employees,

yeah, and you know our
schedules? I know yours does

too. Your schedules change all
the time, and they don't, they

don't bust your

chops for changing the schedule,
and they don't charge you for

the luggage.

And if anybody knows somebody
who is in the executive ranks at

Southwest, we could really
they'd make a great sponsor.

Are you kidding me? Speaking of
sponsors, we got to pay some

bills. We'll be right back

the rich Redman show. We'll be
right back.

Learn by Doing, I definitely
think resonates with what we're

about here at the School of
Rock. I'm Angie McCarthy, and

I'm the owner of the School of
Rock in Franklin and Nashville.

I would say that the majority of
kids that come in have either

been sitting in their bedrooms
watching YouTube, learning how

to play, or they've taken music
lessons at some point in their

life. We do have a lot of
beginners. It doesn't matter

what level you're at, you can
participate in our programs,

whether you're a beginner or
you're advanced. We don't teach

music to put on shows. We put on
shows to teach

music. Connect with School of
Rock today. Search School of

Rock Franklin. Four Nashville.

This is the rich Redmond show.

You know, I used to have my
drums parked right across from

you, over at SSU, and Jim
Handley was your guy forever?

Was your drum tech? Is he still
working with you? He's been with

me over 25 years. And so I would
always look, and I would see you

would have old Yamaha electronic
drums and octopads and things.

You were just like, I better not
get rid of this. Maybe it'll

come back. I was like, it was
like, almost like a museum of

electronic percussion.

I wish I could find the
syndromes. Yeah, I don't know

what happened to him. Just
somewhere along the way, right?

Yeah. They disappeared.

Disco right. Then, did you ever
meet Yogi Horton? Yogi Horton,

he was like, the he played on
the hustle. He was like, Oh, the

disco guy.

I didn't know who would have
played on that, yeah. I didn't

know if it would have been ed or
someone. Yeah,

Ed green, he died, and Ed is
here. Is he not? Ed's here,

yeah,

I did a thing for see him
fantasy weekend. Did you did? I

was thinking you did that last,
last year, fantasy weekend that

they put on rock and roll
fantasy weekend. Oh, I saw him

there. They put it

on a couple of them in Los
Angeles. I thought you had,

yeah. David fish, off.

David Fisher, yeah, used to
manage. This is a great Do we

have time? Sure. So talking to
David. And David used to manage,

road manager, Ringo, right,
right? And so, so we were

talking with David. David's a
great guy. And he said, you know

when? When I said, Well, you
know, with that expensive band

that Ringo takes out and he's
playing the Ryman, do you make

any money? And and David said,
Nah, he doesn't make any money.

Spends it all on private jets,
and, yeah, and, and paying the

band, you know, he's got, I
mean, he's

Luke or therapist, yeah, he's
got expensive, incredibly

expensive band, right? Yeah, he
didn't make any money, but he

stays home. And he's a schmuck,
taking out the trash. He goes on

the road. He's a beetle

Ringo takes out his own trash.
Wow.

You know what? If you guys go to
Paul lime.com it's L, E, I m,

there's a lot of information
about Paul. You can see pictures

of all the celebrities worked
with over the year. His gear,

there's videos, there's a full
discography, and he's got this

thing called Paul's hit
snippets. And so when you've

worked with everyone from Linda
Carter to Shinya Twain and

everybody in between, Reba
McIntyre, Rogers, every you

played on, I've had the time of
my life, the Grammy Award

winning song that I played at
weddings. There's, there's a

little

that's a good pair. I get paid
from that all over the

there's a little medley you have
of just some of your hits. And

so we're gonna fire up a little
bit of this right now. Okay,

take it down memory lane.

Yeah. Got this

feeling. This is normally where
I come in when I'm doing a

clinic. I'll play.

I'll come in and start playing
there, and then, then I'll play

the rest of this whole thing
through. It lasts about 25

minutes. Nice?

Is it me? I love you. Take me
right

back to the

if I'm not

in love, I'm

on the first I'm not in

love, I'm on the verge

over the water,

everything gets hotter when the
sun goes down. That's just

incredible, incredible. Now

you're talking about a changing
industry of the 250 million

records you play on Chennai was
responsible for 75

Of them, at least, yeah.

And then you were saying, you
know, Taylor Swift's just as big

as Shania Twain. She only sold
15 million. Now, that's the

difference. That's

what's happened to our business,
yeah. And obviously, she's ever

been as successful as she now
ever was, but it just it. You

know, she's probably got as
many, if not more, spin. What do

we call them? Any more spin,
spins on spot. Yeah. What do

they call it? Spotify, or the
columns plays, yeah, events, or

whatever it is. But yeah, that's
where, that's how much the

business has changed. It's just,
I don't think, from a CD

standpoint, it is not possible
for that to happen again. And

I'm not bragging. I'm just
saying, unfortunately for guys

coming up, can you say, what,
what you have? What can you

recommend for guys and and
there's the difficult part is

that we all know is you used to
good, go and play a club gig for

100 bucks a month, and you could
get a great apartment for 200

bucks a month. I mean, yeah,
hello, play for 100 bucks a

month. Yeah, that was really and
no go and play for 50 or 100

bucks a night, right? Five
nights a week at a club

somewhere, you may 500 bucks a
week, make couple $1,000 a

month. This back in the 70s,
make a couple $1,000 a month,

and your and your rent was 200
bucks a month at an apartment.

That's a 10 to one ratio, yeah,
and it's a Gosh, and it's just

money went so much further. You
know, they say there's not

inflation now, it's absolute
crap. Inflation is so bad. It's

unbelievable. Yeah, they do it
on purpose. But anyway, you

remember

when I told you about the one of
the episodes we talked about

this, when tool released their
last album, they did something

very interesting, actually, to
encourage a full CD buyout. They

included a digital screen, like
a little LCD screen, that you

could actually play videos on
and download content to, and

encourage people to download the
entire album, as opposed to just

buying a single. That's good,
yeah, it's very innovative, and

it's almost like the pendulum
shift, kind of going back down.

That'd be nice.

That was a business model
invented by the by the New York

attorneys, by the way. But when
Elvis was having hits, it was a

singles business. You never saw
a single from James Taylor,

right, right. Even Neil Diamond,
early 7375 still had some

singles, but you know, after 70,
after 75 there were no singles

anymore, and what they forced
you to do is buy 10 Songs.

Instead of about to get one. You
had to buy 10, right? That was

also a planned thing by very
smart attorneys, right? People

still wanted to just to hear the
hit, and they'd hear the hit on

the radio, but you had to buy
the record, right? So they

basically could force people in
the corner. So from a standpoint

of liking songs or having your
favorite song, our business was

inflated, kind of artificially
for for 2025, years, just from

that business model. As you
know, most things in life are

business model and the so it's
when it left that that's where

the difficulty came in. We're
back to a singles business now.

But now what you're talking
about now if, if, if they are

incentivizing piece people to
buy the entire album. That's

That's beautiful. You remember

when you bought albums, they
still, they told a story. You

know, my first album I listened
to, and I always heart, I get

made fun of online, inflamed by
our fans that I bring up Van

Halen so much. But that was the
first album I listened to, front

to back.

Sunset Sound, right there. They
recorded that whole searcher.

Yeah, man.

But I mean, that was it. You
could read. You remember the

sonic qualities going from song
to song to song, and it told

somewhat of a story. You know,
they're kind of put together. I

mean, that isn't really done
anymore. It's that's got to come

back.

Yeah, talking about sunset.
Sound ever worked there? Yeah.

You know the courtyard in the
middle? Yeah, we were doing

Kenny and Dolly Christmas
record. This little tune called

I believe in Santa Claus, and
I'll be, you know, Christmas

without you. Just anyway, every
Christmas it plays, and Foster's

producing it. So we're out there
on a break, and John Hobbs and

Billy Walker and Joe Schmee were
outside. We're shooting bass,

yeah, shooting hoops. Walker,
Walker, Foster, David Foster,

comes out. And he worked there
so much he came out and he said,

Throw me the ball. And there was
a hoop was on the right side of

the courtyard, and there was a
straight wall on the left,

straight wall on the right,
behind the

behind the hoops on the right,
on the

basketball goal. On the right,
he comes out and he hauls the

ball as hard as he can toward
the wall on the left, it hits,

goes over the top, hits the wall
on the far side and goes through

the net. Nothing but

net. Damn. He just got a golden
touch like. With everything he

does about somebody

can't do anything wrong, he
can't and it was we all just

went

and he has actually, David
Foster has actually fostered

generations of celebrities like
his fit now he's married to

Catherine McCarthy, but then
he's like, his children are all

like, massive influencers in
fashion and cosmetics. So

yeah, we're great friends with
Linda Thompson. He was married

to Linda had kids with Linda
Thompson. They would come to our

house. When they come to town,
they would come to our house,

the golden touch. So speaking of
that, looking back, do you have

favorite producers, musicians,
songwriters, studios, I mean,

because I'm sure kids, unless
you journal or keep a diary,

even me, you know, 2324 years in
a Nashville, it's very blurry.

Someone has to remind you, yeah,
you remember? I don't remember

that, but thank you for
reminding me something like come

to mind,

favorite rooms, favorite
producers. Yeah,

I really enjoyed a lot of guys
didn't enjoy working with mutt,

but I really enjoyed working
with Mutt Lange. He was, when it

comes to music, I'm pretty much
of a perfectionist. I'm a little

bit of a music snob, right?
Because I've done so many

different things

or so, for those that don't
know, he produced Shania, but he

also produced AC, DC and DEF,
Leppard

and Brian Adams and yeah, you
can, you can hear a mutt song in

a second when it comes on. You
know it's mine, but he was great

to work with David Malloy.
Working with David Malloy, I

enjoyed that. Kyle Lenning, for
sure. All the Randy Travis

records, beautiful buddy cannon,
all the Kenny Chesney records.

I've did Kenny Kenny's records
for over 20 years. Nice Guy and

buddy's great guy. Used to be a
bass player on the road with I

can't think of it right now, but
anyway, yeah, the what? I'm so

thankful that that I've had the
opportunity to work in so many

different situations. I'm not
good at doing the same thing.

I'm not sure. I would not
probably have been able to do

what Ronnie tut did and be with
Neil for 35 years. 3540

years, I'm already at 20 and I
play the same 24 songs every

night. Yeah, that's why I got to
go do some

other things. You got to do
something else to keep your

fresh. And because in LA, you
know, in the morning, you'd be

doing an American Airlines
commercial, then that night,

you'd be doing a lot of Richie.
Then the next morning, you'd be

doing Battlestar galactic. And
then that afternoon, you'd be on

a jet flying over to Vegas to do
two shows with Doc Severinsen.

Get on the jet, fly back home,
you'd end up in Universal Studio

The next morning doing Buck
Rogers in the 21st Century.

Yeah, I watched the little
shows. And then you get back on

the jet, and you fly to Vegas,
you do two shows with jock, and

you fly back, and the next
morning, you're at bell sound,

doing American Airlines again.
Then you get, you know, just it

was always something different.
It was so healthy

though. I mean, you were, you
were primed for it, and you were

trained for it, and you were
called for it. You know, when I

was in college, the seven years
that I went to higher education,

studying everything from
playing, you know, Night on Bald

Mountain, you know, mountain on
the symbols to learning crotali

parts and sure over training
myself and really working on my

reading playing in the one
o'clock lab and with charts 20

pages long. Sure, then the music
business dies. And I don't have

an outlet for this stuff. You
know what I mean. But I come and

so when I have to play a three
chord, rock, country song, all

the training makes it super
easy.

Yeah, what, what you trained for
is what I was, I'm not once

again, I'm not bragging. What
I'm saying is, we had an

industry and out in Los Angeles
where you had to go in and sight

read on the drums. And then
when, what? When there wasn't a

cue, like with John Williams,
there wasn't a cue, then you'd

go over and be with Joe Picardo
or Jeff's dad, Joe picaro, or

Emil Richards, or Larry bunker,
or bunk or or or any of the

guys. You'd go over there and
they would put you on a temp

part, or they put you on and I'm
not, I'm not a mallets guy. You

you actually, with your
training, you're you're more

qualified to have done what I
was doing. The problem is, by

the time you it got to the point
where you'd have been very

successful doing movies and
television in Los Angeles with

your experience and knowledge
and education. Seinfeld had come

out, yeah. And instead of a Q
being a full orchestra at

$20,000 a week, it was brown
burpee. And the cat was out of

the bag that you didn't have to
spend that much money every week

on a big on a big orchestra.

Yeah, King of Queens. The music
is like a cash register opening

and closing and finger snaps.

It's insane. It turned into it
turned into Dollar General

Walmart, instead of being Neiman
Marcus music for for every,

every TV show.

God, I missed the Golden Age and
talked to Alex Acuna recently,

who is still in his mid 70s, is
still crushing it playing on all

the Marvel movies and stuff. And
I guess then the new hot guy is

Bernie Dressel. So between.
Cunha and Bernie Dressel.

They're doing all the Marvel
movies and all right, you know?

And that's like the elite, you
know, big budget stuff, and then

everything else for like
independent films and stuff. Is

a laptop composer, so it's
really affected everyone.

And it's the stuff really sounds
good, you know, when I don't,

when I'm producing a record, and
I don't have the budget to hire,

to hire Chris, to do strings and
stuff like that, and do a real

orchestra, you know, you get
somebody like Larry Hall, and it

just sounds fantastic, but
there's a, there's a guilt

factor in there, yeah, because
I'm a, I'm a lifetime musician,

my I'm, I am musicians, I'm your
biggest fan. You know what I'm

saying? I'm, I'm lifetime
musicians. I'm the, I'm the, I'm

their biggest fan.

Well, you're the guy that's
always at the union meetings and

stuff, right?

Not anymore, I know, after being
a trustee and putting so much

time into that, yeah,

I backed away from am I gonna
have

my retirement? Is it gonna be
around?

Yes,

let me ask you. Buy more rental
condos. Yes, that's what I'm

doing. Yes,

you mentioned, like, you know,
you know, I'm a huge Marvel fan,

and part of that, that
experience, is the music. Are

you telling me that it's not? I
mean, the the orchestration of

that music, is it not what I
think it is? It's not a big room

of music. No, that, that is,
that is, yes, but that is, like,

big budget. That is, I mean,
because the music is just

incredible. I mean, the

last and then they did that
Superman music movie where they

had, you know, like 20 drummers
with drum sets. Hans Zimmer

brought in, like, anybody who
owned a drum set at the highest

level in Los Angeles, and
everybody played at the same

time. And I'm

speaking of a layman here, from
a layman standpoint. Give me an

example of the opposite of that,
of what you're talking about.

The

opposite of that would be a
laptop composer who basically

has all sorts of plugins for,
like, right, somebody who's

sampled the Vienna or symphony,
and they have those sounds in

their laptop, and they go, I
really want to have some real

drums and percussion. So then
you come over and you can do

everything at the guy's crib, or
you're set up like this, and you

could do it yourself and send
files to the guy.

But I mean, what? What are like?
You know, the big band example

is Marvel. What's an example of
that where they kind of scale it

down, and they do it off a
laptop, and they come to mind, I

don't

know. I have to look at the
union

contract. A lot of horror films
are like a laptop composers, and

then they may bring sprinkle in
some real instruments here.

Okay, so some of the percussion
sounds you hear now in movies

went to the new Star Wars The
other night, and some of those

sounds you hear those, yeah,
those big sound design. It's

bigger than you can it's bigger
than you can physically make it.

You just can't do that. But an
acoustic instruments, acoustic

instrument insurance instruments
just don't sound like so what?

What a lot of the orchestrators
do, they almost always nowadays,

do a mock up. And if you have an
older guy, say, anybody older

than 45 this is a
generalization, but you take

somebody like Johnny Harris, who
arranged all the Tom Jones

records, and we did all the
Wonder Woman series, and all

like that, with Johnny, when he
does it a mock up, it's, it's

whatever he can get to to get
close and it's, you know, it's,

he'll say, he'll say, this is
cheesy. This is not what it's

going to sound like. Put drums
on this. I'm going to overdub

the orchestra, right? But you
take somebody like on Zimmer,

he's fabulous at doing real
orchestra stuff, and then

they'll overdub the orchestra on
the orchestra stuff he's already

got. So then he's already got
his, he's already got his parts,

parts marked and and spots
picked out through where that

were, the big booms and the big
in, the big sounds that are

bigger than life, yeah. And
that's Michael Bay sounds. Yeah.

That's, that's part of having
the work print ahead of time.

And, yeah, did you ever do, did
you ever do movies and stuff?

I so want to now. I'm now, I'm
just like, you know, I want to

be on the screen, so I started
studying acting, got my sad

card, and I have my voice over
demo. I have a hosting reel.

It's fun just to kind of explore
that other stuff, you know,

yeah, it's icing on the cake.
Yeah, sure. So this has been so

fun. Jim, Yeah, buddy, what did
you learn from our guest? You

know, I've learned the
differences between a real

orchestra and a laptop. I mean,
it's, I had no idea, you know,

I, like I said, if, if you were
to pull up a song, I

could play you one right now,
you would not believe I filled

the conductor of the National
Symphony. Is that on Spotify

track? Look, see if you can go
to go to Amazon music, okay, and

I think it's on Amazon. See, did
I just type in amazon.com

amazon.com and go to Jesse Lee
Jones, who owns Roberts western

world here in town. He's a
Brazil, while you're looking for

that, he's a Brazilian immigrant
that came over and 30 years

after he listened to Tom Jones
and Elvis Presley growing up,

and 30 years after he was here,
he wanted to do this all the

songs that he grew up listening
to that he loved, and he just,

he's a great singer. You know?
He's got the band downtown with

Robert's western world called
Brazil Billy. So they do real

traditional country music. But
he's, he's, he does,

it's funny, but they're

great. They are. They've been
around a long time. Would you?

Jesse Lee. Jones and see if you
can find that, and then see if

that'll show up there. And then

I've been in love so many a
selection of sacred songs. I

wonder

if I'll never see if you can
find I'll never fall in love. I

wonder if

he's on Spotify. Jesse Lee
Jones, because I don't, I don't

know how Amazon Music Works.

Jesse Lee Jones, justice, right
there. Jesse Lee Jones, I'll

never fall in love again.

See if you can find it. And

that looks like dude.

So this is an example of this is
listen to the opening of this.

And the way I the way I

call samples harp,

I've been in love so many times.

Thought I knew the score,

but now you've treated me so
wrong.

I can take anymore.

Yeah, you can kind

of, kind of sort of tell

so, no, you can't. I wanted
this. I wanted this to feel like

an orchestra, Joe gershio Elvis'
conductor, and Mr. Las Vegas, he

would have seven orchestras
going at once in the 70s in

Vegas, he introduced me to to
Jesse Lee and but by that time

with Graceland, I was pretty
much helping Joe all the time

with with coordination and
projects and stuff like that. So

but I wanted this to feel like
it was conducted. And matter of

fact, Joe sat out in the studio
and was conducting while we were

playing. I love him. I miss him
so much. But anyway, so I had, I

had Larry build the orchestra
part first, and we overdubbed

the rhythm section to it. And I
said, Give me a click. Give me a

moving click. I want the click
to move. I don't want it to be I

want it to feel like I want it
to move and flow with the

orchestra first, and then we're
going to, we're going to overdub

the rhythm section to it. He
said, you want to do this

backwards, don't you? And I
said, Yeah, that's what I want

to do. So that's on several
tracks on that record, we were

able to make it feel and it's
not only a rhythm thing.

Orchestras don't play perfect
time, you know, play organic

time. They'll play organic time.
That's a good way to put it. And

so we were able to, when I
brought in Jim Gray, we had to

do the homeless shelter concerts
that we do every year with the

Nashville Symphony had Jim come
in and and do take downs on this

so we could do so we could do it
live with the orchestra. And

when he listened to it, he was
said on that trumpet, he said

that that's a high F. He said, I
know Steve's got a high E. I

didn't, I didn't think he had
high a triple I knew he had a

triple E. I know I have a triple
F. I mean, that's really high.

Yeah. Then he said, Oh, that
French horn players. That's,

that's perfect. That's been
perfect, too. And that must be

Helen. It must be Helen. He's,
he's telling me who my band is,

right, right?

Did you say anything? Not for a

while, I didn't. And of course,
his his copyist was there too.

And when I finally said, guys,
it's all faux in copies. Oh, no,

I knew. I knew it.

I knew that was all Yeah, I
could tell,

oh, my god, so Jim, what I
learned is that to survive and

thrive in five decades of the
music business, you have to

grow, evolve and change. Stay
Ahead of things, embrace things,

be a knowledgeable, likable
person, and show up with your

big boy pants ready to rock. 30
minutes early. 30 minutes early

is the way to go get your cup of
coffee. Guys. There's a lot of

podcasts out there. Our one ask
of you is, if you love what's

happening here, tell a friend
about it. Give us a rating.

Leave us a review School of
Rock. Thank you so much for

being a sponsor of the show.
Guys, be sure to check out Paul

lime.com if you're a drummer,
make sure you get a hold of the

recordings. Transcribe them,
play along with them, soak up

this guy's DNA. If you're a non
musician, just reach out to Paul

and say thank you for five
decades of American music

making. Thanks for being my
guest, my friend. Thank you for

having real pleasure. Happy New
Year everyone. Thank you coming

back for the good stuff. We'll
see you next time.

See. This has been the rich
Redmond show. Subscribe, rate

and follow along at rich
redmond.com forward, slash

podcasts. You.